Ok if you have no point or don't want to explain, buy!tiltbillings wrote:Hmmm. A trick question.Cittasanto wrote:
and what point is that?
Ajahn Brahm for sale?
- Cittasanto
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.
He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
- tiltbillings
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Unquestionably, but I wonder if they need to suffer under conformity to the symbolic significance, which seems to be what this thread is really about.Mr Man wrote:
I don't know if they have to be dour but they do have great symbolic significance (a manifestation of the tripple gem) and are part of a tradition.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
I'd take him Go-Kart riding.tiltbillings wrote:I'd have my own prvt retreat and let him run the schedule.
Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.
Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.
His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta
Stuff I write about things.
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.
Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.
His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta
Stuff I write about things.
- retrofuturist
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Greetings,
Metta,
Retro.
It's hardly "suffer[ing] under conformity" to not be auctioning one's self and the bhikkhu's saffron robes to the highest bidder.tiltbillings wrote:Unquestionably, but I wonder if they need to suffer under conformity to the symbolic significance, which seems to be what this thread is really about.Mr Man wrote:
I don't know if they have to be dour but they do have great symbolic significance (a manifestation of the tripple gem) and are part of a tradition.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
- Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
I would say its an indication of desperation. Apparently the nuns are not getting as much financial support as they need, or are their plans just too ambitious?Mr Man wrote:If I were to put a positive spin on it I would say that it meant more as a wake up call and to make it clear that more support is needed and this is how far the Ven. Ajahn will go rather than a serious new development in fund raising techniques.
Perhaps Ajahn Brahm should try to get some bookings for stand-up gigs instead of sit-down gigs?
The baseless accusations of dour-faced Buddhists disapproving of the Venerable Brahmavamso's silliness just shows that some are totally ignorant of the Vinaya and the Buddhist tradition.
If the nuns are serious about following the Bhikkhuni Vinaya, they should reject any funds received by inappropriate methods. If they want to live the holy life in full let them try to raise their own funds in ways that are appropriate for monastics — which basically means waiting for an offer of support to be made (although if one has no dwelling place it is allowable to drop a hint). Such limitations do not apply to lay supporters or devotees — they can appeal for funds, or organise food-fairs, etc., to raise funds even for a “multi-million dollar project.”
NP20: Should any bhikkhu engage in various types of trade, it (the article obtained) is to be forfeited and confessed.
Blog • Pāli Fonts • In This Very Life • Buddhist Chronicles • Software (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)
- tiltbillings
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Probably not totally baseless or totally ignorant, bhante, but I am certainly finding the intensity of the negative response to Ven Brahm's curious choice interesting and bit unfortunate. As i have said, those of you who are finding Ven B's action a scandal, you should get together and send him a detailed objection to his "selling" of himself. No doubt his response would be of no small intertest to many of us on either side or no side of this tea-pottish storm.Bhikkhu Pesala wrote:
The baseless accusations of dour-faced Buddhists disapproving of the Venerable Brahmavamso's silliness just shows that some are totally ignorant of the Vinaya and the Buddhist tradition.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Some may be interested in our sister site Dharma Wheel's response to the same news:
http://dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... ad601c31a4
http://dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... ad601c31a4
_/|\_
Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
If this sale thing is OK for bhikkhus, then in my opinion the bhikkhunis should have gone for:
Bhikkhunis for sale!
With photos and intro videos, if they are otherwise unknown. They should strive for independence instead of always relying on some father figure.
Bhikkhunis for sale!
With photos and intro videos, if they are otherwise unknown. They should strive for independence instead of always relying on some father figure.
- tiltbillings
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Those Mahayanists. Not dour.Dan74 wrote:Some may be interested in our sister site Dharma Wheel's response to the same news:
http://dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... ad601c31a4
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
- retrofuturist
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Greetings,
Doesn't work for me, but best of luck to them.
Metta,
Retro.
... with their institutionalized precedent of Vinaya violations in the name of skilful means and bodhisattva ideals?tiltbillings wrote:Those Mahayanists. Not dour.
Doesn't work for me, but best of luck to them.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Indeed these are problematic. Absolutes on the other hand, are much more comforting.retrofuturist wrote:Greetings,
... with their institutionalized precedent of Vinaya violations in the name of skilful means and bodhisattva ideals?tiltbillings wrote:Those Mahayanists. Not dour.
Doesn't work for me, but best of luck to them.
Metta,
Retro.
_/|\_
- retrofuturist
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Greetings,
Metta,
Retro.
Not absolutes - just the Dhammavinaya laid down by The Teacher.Dan74 wrote:Indeed these are problematic. Absolutes on the other hand, are much more comforting.
Metta,
Retro.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Dhammavinaya or a take on Dhammavinaya?retrofuturist wrote:Greetings,
Not absolutes - just the Dhammavinaya laid down by The Teacher.Dan74 wrote:Indeed these are problematic. Absolutes on the other hand, are much more comforting.
Metta,
Retro.
It seems these discussions return to the same point - are we conflating the teachings with an interpretation of the teachings? And is there one correct interpretation which is therefore equivalent to the teachings themselves?
My motivation will likely be taken as being insecure or defensive. Samasara, eh? We do the same rounds over and over again...
_/|\_
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Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Hi
Sense of humour apart (!), I just find it a bit tacky that a Bhikkhu should slot so seemlessly into the consumerist paradigm that everything has a price and may be bought.. Returning to the marketplace, and skilful means justify the ends, perhaps
But it isn't going against the stream is it?
Sense of humour apart (!), I just find it a bit tacky that a Bhikkhu should slot so seemlessly into the consumerist paradigm that everything has a price and may be bought.. Returning to the marketplace, and skilful means justify the ends, perhaps
But it isn't going against the stream is it?
Re: Ajahn Brahm for sale?
Can one of the dour-faces please point out exactly which Vinaya rule is being transgressed?