This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

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jackson
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby jackson » Sat Mar 09, 2013 1:12 pm

Greetings Manas, keep at it! :clap:
You asked if the cravings go away, so I'd like to share my experience, maybe it will help. Like most smokers, I started in High School and smoked about 3/4 of a pack a day. This went on for a while until I decided I wanted to quit, then I quit for a few months here, a few months there, around a year at one point, 20 months another, on and on. What kept happening was that I would start out with strong willpower which would hold off the cravings for a while, but then in a moment of weakness I would succumb to the craving and immediately be right back where I started.
Then I read about a mindfulness technique where you simply be as mindful as possible while smoking and ask yourself just what it is you enjoy about smoking. It took very little time for me to realize I actually enjoyed nothing whatsoever about cigarettes and that I was actually only smoking them to get rid of the feeling of nicotine withdrawl. Repulsion set in and quitting was the easiest it had ever been. No longer was it necessary to exercise willpower, if the desire arose I'd just think back to the last period I smoked and how disgusting and unfulfilling the cigarettes were. So anyway, that was over 5 years ago, and the cravings are practically nonexistent but if the thought does arise it just passes. It has no power.
I've found that with bad habits if I can go two years without acting on them then it's easier to have a proper perspective and see them in their proper light, until then the addiction still holds sway. Anyway, if you make it through this week I say go for another week. Just destroy the tobacco so you don't have to think about it and keep going. Don't think about quitting forever, just take it a day at a time, a moment at a time if you have to.
Best wishes! :toast:
"The heart of the path is quite easy. There’s no need to explain anything at length. Let go of love and hate and let things be. That’s all that I do in my own practice." - Ajahn Chah

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Billymac29
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Billymac29 » Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:55 pm

Good posting jackson...

I used a "mindfulness technique" to help me quit too.... (its been over 2 yrs for me with no wanting to ever return) I would just sit with the craving and be with it.. I would kinda dissect it to really observe it until the craving would go away... They say nicotine cravings only last a few minutes at a pop so if you can just be with it for a few minutes, it will pass... After the 2nd week its clear sailing...!
Keep going Manas

all the best
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"

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Kamran
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Kamran » Sun Mar 10, 2013 6:48 am

Smoking caused my father to die of a heart attack at age 39...

Quitting is the best thing you can do for yourself and your family.

I wish you well.
When this concentration is thus developed, thus well developed by you, then wherever you go, you will go in comfort. Wherever you stand, you will stand in comfort. Wherever you sit, you will sit in comfort. Wherever you lie down, you will lie down in comfort.

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manas
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby manas » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:08 pm

Seven day mark now passed.

I have reached the goal I set. I could not have done this without all the support I received, from so many of you. A heartfelt thank you, to each and every one.

:anjali:

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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Justsit » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:57 pm

So...gonna try another day or two? ;)

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manas
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Re: ten days with zero tobacco

Postby manas » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:25 am

Hi everyone.

I revisited my old habit. I had less than usual - just one smoke. And I now have a slightly sick feeling, the sickly sensation of faint nausea that I used to get with tobacco, long ago. I think that what has happened, is that my body, having discharged some of the toxins over seven days, is telling me something, just like it did in no uncertain terms when I first had tobacco many years back. It is giving a more honest assessment of this substance, something along the lines of "yuk, please stop doing this!"

The seven day stint I made was very challenging, but there was also something about it that i kind of miss. The feeling of renouncing something that is unhealthy for me. Doing something that is hard to do, but bears a pleasant result. The Buddha would agree (I think) that it is unwise to smoke tobacco, even if it is not strictly speaking an intoxicant that causes us to act in reckless ways such as alcohol does.

So, I have decided to do another stint, but I will begin counting from tomorrow. Tomorrow will be a new 'Day One'. This time I will do TEN days with no smoking. I hereby make this publicly known.

Members need not trouble themselves with having to support me so much this time around (unless they really want to). By all means feel free, but don't feel obliged. Because, this next stint will probably not be the last either. But I am making progress towards totally ending this habit, I can feel it.

By the way, I just took the remaining tobacco in the packet - good quality stuff it is, too - and drenched it in water to ruin it, and placed it in the rubbish bin. Last time I hid it in a deserted place, but this time I have thrown it away. I'm going to kick this habit for good, ultimately. But I will do it in stages. So, tomorrow is a new 'Day One' and the beginning of 'TEN days with zero tobacco'.

With metta, and gladness that this forum exists,

manas.

:anjali:

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manas
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby manas » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:36 am

I do have a question for anyone who knows about this. In my travels on the Internet, I have heard apologists for tobacco say things like, "the Native Americans smoked tobacco, and because it was natural and not processed with chemicals as ours is today, they didn't get the same dire health problems from it, that we now do". That was one of the reasons I thought that, so long as I used organic or chemical free, that it wouldn't be quite so bad. Have any other members heard of such arguments? Don't worry, I'm still aiming to give up regardless, but I'm just curious if anyone else has read such things.

metta

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Kamran
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Kamran » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:58 am

I am not sure, but would think cigarettes that had filters on them would be slightly healthier than hand rolled or pipe smoked tobacco that has no filter(unless smoked out of a bong).

Some smokers comfort themselves by smoking the "lite" cigarettes that have slightly less tar and nicotene, but its really just a marketing tactic, and they suffer the same consequences as the regular smokers.
When this concentration is thus developed, thus well developed by you, then wherever you go, you will go in comfort. Wherever you stand, you will stand in comfort. Wherever you sit, you will sit in comfort. Wherever you lie down, you will lie down in comfort.

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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby LonesomeYogurt » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:13 am

manas wrote:I do have a question for anyone who knows about this. In my travels on the Internet, I have heard apologists for tobacco say things like, "the Native Americans smoked tobacco, and because it was natural and not processed with chemicals as ours is today, they didn't get the same dire health problems from it, that we now do". That was one of the reasons I thought that, so long as I used organic or chemical free, that it wouldn't be quite so bad. Have any other members heard of such arguments? Don't worry, I'm still aiming to give up regardless, but I'm just curious if anyone else has read such things.

metta

First off, smoking anything is bad for your lungs.

More importantly, the idea that Native Americans actually smoked tobacco for recreation, either in cigarettes or pipes, is a boldfaced lie invented and pushed by tobacco/cigarette companies. While it's true that Amerindians did grow and consume tobacco, it was always done for either spiritual or communal trade purposes, or occasionally used as medicine. I live in an area with many First Nations people and the vast majority of tribal leaders here are adamantly opposed to cigarette smoking as recreation precisely because they consider it offensive in the context of their spiritual tradition. An elder for the Cour d'Alene Indians recently told me that before the natives encountered European industrialization, the average Indian man smoked about six cigarette's worth of tobacco a year.

In truth, the post-colonization tobacco trade was absolutely horrible for Amerinidans as well as Africans - tobacco is a dirty and blood-stained industry, and it always has been.
Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.

Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.

His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta

Stuff I write about things.

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Kim OHara
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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Kim OHara » Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:25 am

LonesomeYogurt wrote:... tobacco is a dirty and blood-stained industry, and it always has been.

Yep.
You might also like to check out Merchants of Doubt. The tobacco companies were the originators of the systematic pseudo-scientific denialist tactics which have since been used in defence of the plastics, pesticides, chemical and fossil fuel industries. Their basic plot was, "We know we're selling poison but we are going to pretend we don't know while we quietly pay lots of people to say it ain't poison."
Start here http://www.merchantsofdoubt.org/ or here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merchants_of_Doubt.

:namaste:
Kim

edit: fixed typo

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Re: ten days with zero tobacco

Postby Alobha » Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:49 am

manas wrote:
So, I have decided to do another stint, but I will begin counting from tomorrow. Tomorrow will be a new 'Day One'. This time I will do TEN days with no smoking. I hereby make this publicly known.


Go for it! May you move on with energy and determination! :smile:

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manas
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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby manas » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:35 am

An elder for the Cour d'Alene Indians recently told me that before the natives encountered European industrialization, the average Indian man smoked about six cigarette's worth of tobacco a year.


So, maybe the idea that they were choofing away 'till the cows came home was possibly planted by...someone connected with the Tobacco Industry.

Go for it! May you move on with energy and determination!


If someone like myself could actually get a taste for renunciation, it would be a miracle. But, miracles are known to happen sometimes.

Thanks for your continuing supportiveness, dear members.

Ok, craving will be extinguished, beginning with: craving for tobacco! :jedi: It's days are numbered...

metta

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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby Modus.Ponens » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:14 pm

manas wrote:I do have a question for anyone who knows about this. In my travels on the Internet, I have heard apologists for tobacco say things like, "the Native Americans smoked tobacco, and because it was natural and not processed with chemicals as ours is today, they didn't get the same dire health problems from it, that we now do". That was one of the reasons I thought that, so long as I used organic or chemical free, that it wouldn't be quite so bad. Have any other members heard of such arguments? Don't worry, I'm still aiming to give up regardless, but I'm just curious if anyone else has read such things.

metta


That is a quite ridiculous claim by the tobacco apologists, because native americans didn't have apropriate medicine, so, in average, they wouldn't live enough to have cancer. Even if they lived long enough, they wouldn't know that it was caused by tobacco.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

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manas
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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby manas » Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:01 am

Day One

It's a lot easier this time around. I know the territory better, plus, I think most of the toxins were discharged with the seven-day stint already. Now it's just the mind that is tempted sometimes.

It's funny how perspective changes. I'm now a little irritated with myself, that I still am dependent on doing this in a public forum, where I would be too embarrassed to break the abstinence. "I ought to be able to do this alone!" runs a thought in my mind. But this system is working so well. Because, I know that someone will read these posts, sooner or later. And, I promised publicly to be honest about whether I stick with this or not. And, I won't lie about such a thing, especially not to a (virtual) room full of Buddhists!

I recall that, once a month, the monks in a monastery would 'confess' any transgressions they had made in the preceding month. I imagine that the thought of having to fess up to things, would give even more of an incentive to not transgress in the first place, ie, to be spotless in one's conduct. And so, living alone, who can one turn to, to be accountable to (if one so voluntarily chooses)? 'The Virtual Sangha'. For ten days, in the matter of tobacco use, I voluntarily choose to be accountable to the members here. I wish to recommend this, if anyone else has a particular goal that pushes them beyond what is comfortable, and needs some spurring on to accomplish. It works.

:anjali:

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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby cooran » Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:19 am

Keep at it, Manas - we're barracking for you!! :clap:

With metta,
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby Aloka » Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:41 am

When I stopped smoking years ago, I chewed a piece of chewing gum instead of having a smoke.

Later I needed to give up the chewing gum habit too. :mrgreen:

Good luck manas, you can do it !

.

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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby Dmytro » Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:57 pm

It's awesome, Manas!

Perhaps a friendly tip will be of help - noticing the precise feeling of craving, with accompanying emotion, and encompassing it with equanimous loving-kindness, helped me to deal with old addiction.

:namaste:

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Re: seven days with zero tobacco

Postby marc108 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:26 pm

manas wrote:I do have a question for anyone who knows about this. In my travels on the Internet, I have heard apologists for tobacco say things like, "the Native Americans smoked tobacco, and because it was natural and not processed with chemicals as ours is today, they didn't get the same dire health problems from it, that we now do". That was one of the reasons I thought that, so long as I used organic or chemical free, that it wouldn't be quite so bad. Have any other members heard of such arguments? Don't worry, I'm still aiming to give up regardless, but I'm just curious if anyone else has read such things.

metta


I've done quite a bit of research on disease levels in Native Americans for school and I can tell you that is outright not true. Firstly, there is little-no research data on Native Americans prior to 1940-50's so to say they didn't get health problems is not true. Now, Native Americans have disease rates that are drastically higher than average. Their rates of diabetes, cardiovascular disease & cancer are generally 2-3x higher than average.

The primary carcinogens in tobacco exist naturally in the tobacco plant and are not additives or processing chemicals.

Anyone who tells you smoking tobacco in any way, shape, or form is not harmful or less harmful is deluded.
"It's easy for us to connect with what's wrong with us... and not so easy to feel into, or to allow us, to connect with what's right and what's good in us."

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manas
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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby manas » Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:24 pm

Day 2 :woohoo:

In my case, I was using either organic or 'processed chemical-free' and while it did leave me much less nauseated than ordinary tobacco, I can recall a few times when i would draw the smoke in and would actually feel a sort of constriction happening all through my body. My heart rate would go up, too. I looked this up, and it said that the nicotene causes the blood vessels to constrict, and the heart has to word harder as a result. These sensations, and the knowledge of why they were happening, were the impetus behind my first resolve to stop. I thought, "this is harming you, and sometimes even causes headaches in the mornings, etc, yet you crave it?" It is messed up to crave that which harms you. So addiction is like getting yourself in to a hole, you decide one day that you want out, but it's not so easy. it takes time. You are not out as soon as you make that first sincere volition to quit.

Again, my advice to anyone considering quitting: the sooner you quit, the easier it will be. Delaying the process will mean more pain, from what I have observed in persons who smoked more heavily than I.

I'm going outside. It is 4.30 am here, I'm up earlier than usual. The air is fresh, cool and fragrant (there are forests not too far from where I live). I'm going to deeply inhale the air, and notice the effect that clean, more highly oxygenated air has on my system...

Thanks all

:anjali:

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Re: This time: TEN days, zero tobacco

Postby Dmytro » Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:01 am

Lots of fresh and clean air to you :smile:


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