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Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really? - Page 17 - Dhamma Wheel

Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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beeblebrox
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby beeblebrox » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:52 pm

I think it's only eternalism if someone tries to view it in that way.

Just consider the following: there are some people who say that the Buddha taught nihilism. Does that mean that the Buddha himself was a nihilist? Of course not... it's just these people who have a nihilist view of the teachings, even when they claim themselves to not be nihilists. That kind view is very subtle... but still quite significant. It's a part of what causes the dukkha. I think it's exactly this sort of thing that the Buddha taught about the wrong views, and also about what the right view would entail.

It should be really obvious to anyone who practices anyway, that a jhana always end sometimes... or to put it more accurately, they haven't yet encountered a jhana that is permanent... or else they wouldn't be going back to the sitting, secluding themselves, etc. There's no way to not realize this, unless you're really delusional about it. It doesn't really matter what kind of explanation you give it... it's still all a sign of impermanence. It's due to dependent origination... the moments have nothing to do with it.

"Moments" don't really bother me, though... I've argued very strongly against "flux" somewhere on this forum before. (Anicca might describe flux, but that doesn't mean the anicca is a flux in itself.) That doesn't mean that my opinion is changing between these two... it's just that when I think I see someone is attaching his own views to either one of those... I'll try to say something about it. Neither of those two has anything to do with the Dhamma, and therefore aren't necessary for practice. Neither of those will give you any insight about the view-clinging, anyway.

:anjali:

SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:34 am

I believe myself to be a follower of suttas rather than later literatures (without criticizing them). But when I read the Buddha's words about anicca I find his anicca to be anicca of all sorts (coarse to momentariness). If understood and directly seen I don't think it can be called a "ditthi" or a mere conceptual fiction of momentariness. It is what actually is. Actually the other anicca that are coarser than momentariness are fabrications and can lead to conceptualized anicca which is still good object of contemplation.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:45 am


SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:53 am


SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:58 am


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tiltbillings
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby tiltbillings » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:20 am


SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:26 am


Nyana
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby Nyana » Wed Apr 17, 2013 2:43 pm


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polarbear101
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby polarbear101 » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:16 pm

"I don't envision a single thing that, when developed & cultivated, leads to such great benefit as the mind. The mind, when developed & cultivated, leads to great benefit."

"I don't envision a single thing that, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about such suffering & stress as the mind. The mind, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about suffering & stress."

SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:12 pm

Last edited by SamKR on Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SamKR
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby SamKR » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:15 pm


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waterchan
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby waterchan » Wed May 07, 2014 1:50 am

*breathes life into this thread once again*

This has been a very illuminating discussion on the subject of commentarial notions vs suttic notions and I'd like to read more.
quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur
(Anything in Latin sounds profound.)

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tiltbillings
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby tiltbillings » Wed May 07, 2014 2:56 am


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waterchan
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby waterchan » Wed May 07, 2014 3:28 am

quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur
(Anything in Latin sounds profound.)

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tiltbillings
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby tiltbillings » Wed May 07, 2014 3:42 am


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waterchan
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby waterchan » Wed May 07, 2014 3:56 am

quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur
(Anything in Latin sounds profound.)

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tiltbillings
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby tiltbillings » Wed May 07, 2014 4:04 am


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waterchan
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Re: Vipassanā: What Is Dissolution, Really?

Postby waterchan » Wed May 07, 2014 4:19 am

quidquid Latine dictum sit altum videtur
(Anything in Latin sounds profound.)


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