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the ethics of lay teachers who charge money - Page 4 - Dhamma Wheel

the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Buddhist ethical conduct including the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).
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marc108
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby marc108 » Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:24 pm

I would be interested to see what the Sayadaw would say if he knew his students were charging 150$ an hour for Meditation lessons!

The more I receive teachings from my (lay) Teacher the more abhorrent I find charging for the Dhamma. My Teacher has not even -mentioned- Dana to me, he's instructed, given phone, email and in person interviews as well as weekly sittings and monthly day longs completely free with no strings attached... In fact he pays a large portion of the cost of renting our building himself!
"It's easy for us to connect with what's wrong with us... and not so easy to feel into, or to allow us, to connect with what's right and what's good in us."

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Hanzze
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby Hanzze » Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:21 am

As it is often about "while living on the food offered by the faithful..." I guess the might be very related to this.

Ven. Sayadaw would not say much, he had declared such things very often already. One can not change others.
Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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LonesomeYogurt
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby LonesomeYogurt » Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:02 am

I find the whole idea of lay teachers a little weird - it seems to me that if you want to make a livelihood out of teaching the Dhamma, you should become a monk. To my knowledge, the idea of a "lay teacher" who makes cash off teaching and guiding retreats is a totally western, capitalistic invention. There are tons of great lay teachers out there, but I think that it does have the side-effect of making monasticism seem unnecessary or even unideal.

Just my two cents.
Gain and loss, status and disgrace,
censure and praise, pleasure and pain:
these conditions among human beings are inconstant,
impermanent, subject to change.

Knowing this, the wise person, mindful,
ponders these changing conditions.
Desirable things don’t charm the mind,
undesirable ones bring no resistance.

His welcoming and rebelling are scattered,
gone to their end,
do not exist.
- Lokavipatti Sutta


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Hanzze
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby Hanzze » Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:13 am

Just that! *smile*


BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Nate sante baram sokham _()_

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marc108
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby marc108 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:41 pm

Video: Selling the Dharma
http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2012/11/vi ... -container


gotta love it... self-righteous justification for selling the Dhamma! please also read the last bit of comments where Vince Horn justifies charging 50-100$ an hour for meditation instruction by saying the Dana-based teaching structure is a 'fundamentalist, literalist interpretation' :clap:
"It's easy for us to connect with what's wrong with us... and not so easy to feel into, or to allow us, to connect with what's right and what's good in us."

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Cittasanto
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby Cittasanto » Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:10 pm



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

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David N. Snyder
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby David N. Snyder » Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:55 pm

We live in the information age. As my son recently put it, "information is no longer a commodity." We live in an age with quick and easy access to information with the internet, wikipedia, Access to Insight, Dhamma Wiki, Dhamma Wheel, and numerous other sites offering information and instruction and access to the Suttas at no charge.

As a result, the lay teachers and centers charging exorbitant fees may find fewer and fewer customers over time. There is certainly nothing wrong with charging for facilities such as room and board, meals, etc, but the high fees for simply information about the Dhamma? That appears to cross a line that the Buddha did not want crossed. And perhaps the information age will take care of that and the allure of paying high prices for it will fade away.
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carlosm
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby carlosm » Mon Dec 10, 2012 2:56 pm


SamKR
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby SamKR » Mon Dec 10, 2012 11:12 pm

Come, give me money and only then I will teach you how to get rid of your greed...
Something doesn't sound quite right. :thinking:

dhammaprotectors
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby dhammaprotectors » Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:35 am

What about monastic organisations or sangha :buddha1: asking directly for donations for their so-called charity projects instead of by way of dana?

What about Ajahn Brahm asking for a fixed upfront money to participate to bid in an auction sale to book him ("Ajahn Brahm for sale")?
Is this right livelihood of monastic although it says it's for raising fund for his bhikkhunis sangha?
Cannot help thinking why a Bhikkhu Sangha is involving in the affairs of a Bhikkhuni Sangha & why is the money donating to a Bhikkhu Sangha and not directly to the Nun monastery?
Why is Ajahn Brahm in control of the Bhikkhuni Sangha & their affairs? It's complicated.

Find it indeed shocking :jawdrop: that monastic is allowed to do such thing.
Isn't their authority the Dhamma Vinaya :rules: and is this not against the Vinaya or the spirit of dana?

Any thoughts on this? :juggling: :thinking: :namaste:

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polarbear101
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby polarbear101 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:02 am

There's a whole thread on that issue dhammaprotector

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=16465&start=0
"I don't envision a single thing that, when developed & cultivated, leads to such great benefit as the mind. The mind, when developed & cultivated, leads to great benefit."

"I don't envision a single thing that, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about such suffering & stress as the mind. The mind, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about suffering & stress."

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reflection
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby reflection » Mon Apr 15, 2013 9:07 am

Haha, awesome.

dhammaprotectors
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby dhammaprotectors » Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:22 am


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marc108
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby marc108 » Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:17 am

Ajahn Brahm is clearly the frontman because the Bhikkhunis want it.

This is not comparing apples to apples. The amount of Dhamma teaching Ajahn Brahm has put out into the world
Is perhaps unmatched in a thousand years. Ajahn Brahm isnt charging for his teachings. He isn't trying to fund himself or his own monastery, he's trying to fund the Bhikkhuni Sanga. This isn't the same as charging 150$/hour for meditation lessons.
"It's easy for us to connect with what's wrong with us... and not so easy to feel into, or to allow us, to connect with what's right and what's good in us."

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tiltbillings
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:25 am

Just a note: This thread will not be for re-litigating the Ajahn Brahm for sale question.

alan...
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby alan... » Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:55 pm

the buddha and his disciples and so on and so on never charged so much as a single masaka so...

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manas
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby manas » Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:17 pm

Last edited by manas on Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Then the Blessed One, picking up a tiny bit of dust with the tip of his fingernail, said to the monk, "There isn't even this much form...feeling...
perception...fabrications...consciousness that is constant, lasting, eternal, not subject to change, that will stay just as it is as long as eternity."

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retrofuturist
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:18 pm

Greetings,

Well said, manas.

:thumbsup:

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Nyorai
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby Nyorai » Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:58 am

If you had achieved a stage of considering yourself having the ability to impart wisdom teaching of Buddhism, means one is able to live simply and moderately with ultimate joys of basic foods and simple shelter. There is no reason to charge for meditation lesson as this is inherent quality of all. The generous sharing and teaching of true dharma will develop even more insightfully beyond materialism. If the condition is not favorable to share with minimum expenses or without donor, there is no requirement to set up meditation class. Most essentially is to keep an extremely low cost so that everyone can enjoy and experience their inherent peace. The most favorable buddhism institution for meditation is those that does not charge a single cent as it does not give rise to any burden and welcome even the pauper :broke: to experience their own joys of meditation. There is nothing most precious than assisting anyone to become buddha :buddha1:

“Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without.” :toilet:
― Gautama Buddha
ImageTo become vegetarian is to step into the stream which leads to nirvana.
If you light a lamp for somebody, it will also brighten your path. He who experiences the unity of life sees his own Self in all beings, and all beings in his own Self.Image

alan...
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Re: the ethics of lay teachers who charge money

Postby alan... » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:06 am



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