kirk5a wrote:BlackBird wrote:Spot on Tilt. A side from being able to pick said ariyans brains for how to get there oneself, what good does it do you to know whether someone's an arahant or not. You've still got to do the work yourself. There's no short cuts in Dhamma.
What good does it do to proclaim that someone is not an arahant, has wrong view, and is a liar, as you have done?
I don't recall calling anyone a liar - I think you're putting words in my mouth there and I don't think that's very nice of you. But clearly the gloves are off in your instance.
Do you think we should just avoid critical analysis of people's declarations of supernormal attainments? Because (I'm sure you're aware) there's a big difference between being critical of a crystal clear declaration in print that Monk-X is an arahant, and being critical of people who speculate that so and so might or might not be an arahant.
If someone makes the statement: X is an arahant. And we believe the evidence suggests otherwise, do we not have a duty to proclaim that we believe this is untrue? Is it not in everyone's interests to be aware that such a person is at the very least overestimating their teacher, that they gained their material for the book from stories told to them from other monks, from many sources, some 2nd and 3rd hand. Does it not stand to reason that accounts were embellished through the monk-vine?
People deserve to be informed, to have as much knowledge at hand when they make decisions. People might make all sorts of decisions from reading a positive account of a teacher. I certainly know that several years ago a factor in my decision to go to Sri Lanka was made based on the fact that so many of those on a certain retreat I attended felt that the teacher was an ariyan, and I agreed with them.
So what we can draw from my example is that people are willing to go out of their way to learn under those whom they believe to be enlightened.
If you have a good argument otherwise, people should know so they can make the best decisions possible for their meditation and progress in the Dhamma.
You have read the book I suppose?There's more magic and flowery goings on in that book than the most elaborate of Mahayana sutras, personally I know that that's not what the Buddha's teaching is concerned with. It's concerned with dukkha and it's cessation.