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Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How? - Dhamma Wheel

Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
SamKR
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Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:11 am

Last edited by SamKR on Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:09 am, edited 2 times in total.

SarathW
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SarathW » Tue Jul 23, 2013 3:48 am

Very simply put it, you raise your question due to your previous fabrications! :)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

SamKR
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:13 am


SarathW
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SarathW » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:19 am

Buy reading a Buddhist book you conditioned your mind to think that there is something called “Sankhara”
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

SamKR
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:22 am

I understand that something can condition other things. But the question is: how do vinnana (six consciousness) arise due to sankhara (bodily, verbal, and mental (past volitional?) fabrications)? How does that process (of fabrications conditioning/causing consciousness) work?
Last edited by SamKR on Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

SarathW
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SarathW » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:27 am

There are no two things called Vinnanam and Sankhara.
They both the same. They arise in tandem. They condition each other.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

SamKR
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Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 4:33 pm

Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:33 am


SarathW
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SarathW » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:37 am

When you eliminate ignorance you see everything as one! :)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

SamKR
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Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 4:33 pm

Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:39 am


chownah
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby chownah » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:46 am

SamKR,
Is this what you are looking for? It is from MN28:

Dependent Co-arising
"Now if internally the eye is intact but externally forms do not come into range, nor is there a corresponding engagement, then there is no appearing of the corresponding type of consciousness. If internally the eye is intact and externally forms come into range, but there is no corresponding engagement, then there is no appearing of the corresponding type of consciousness. But when internally the eye is intact and externally forms come into range, and there is a corresponding engagement, then there is the appearing of the corresponding type of consciousness.

"The form of what has thus come into being is gathered under the form clinging-aggregate. The feeling of what has thus come into being is gathered under the feeling clinging-aggregate. The perception of what has thus come into being is gathered under the perception clinging-aggregate. The fabrications of what has thus come into being are gathered under the fabrication clinging-aggregate. The consciousness of what has thus come into being is gathered under the consciousness clinging-aggregate. One discerns, 'This, it seems, is how there is the gathering, meeting, & convergence of these five clinging-aggregates. Now, the Blessed One has said, "Whoever sees dependent co-arising sees the Dhamma; whoever sees the Dhamma sees dependent co-arising."[4] And these things — the five clinging-aggregates — are dependently co-arisen.[5] Any desire, embracing, grasping, & holding-on to these five clinging-aggregates is the origination of stress. Any subduing of desire & passion, any abandoning of desire & passion for these five clinging-aggregates is the cessation of stress.' [6] And even to this extent, friends, the monk has accomplished a great deal......
........
........"

It continues on.....

chownah

SamKR
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:00 am

Thanks, chownah, but that does not seem to answer my question. I understand that due to "eye" and "forms" there appears eye-consciousness as described in your quote, but how does that eye-consciousness co-arise with "eye" and "forms"? I think such eye-consciousness may appear depending upon something else too, and that "something else" is sankhara. Then the quesiton is how does sankhara (bodily, verbal, mental) give rise to eye-consciousness? Perhaps, sankhara fashions the "eye", "range" and "corresponding engagement" thus fashioning consciousness.

I don't find any suttas that directly answer my questions (if there are, it would be great). That is why I posted my question in Open Dhamma forum so that I may get other members' personal opinions and understandings/insights as well
Last edited by SamKR on Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:13 am, edited 3 times in total.

chownah
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby chownah » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:09 am

You are right, I didn't answer your question......somehow I got off track...sorry for that. It's a good question you are asking and I'll be thinking about it while I go make sure the water level in the rice paddy is where I want it and I'll be checking back later to see how the discussion is proceeding.
chownah

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tiltbillings
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby tiltbillings » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:55 am


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reflection
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby reflection » Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:36 am


santa100
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby santa100 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:55 pm


SamKR
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:46 pm


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reflection
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby reflection » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:50 pm


chownah
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby chownah » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:47 am


SamKR
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby SamKR » Thu Jul 25, 2013 2:37 pm


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reflection
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Re: Sankhara-paccaya Vinnanam: How?

Postby reflection » Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:34 pm

You're welcome :anjali:


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