Minimalist living

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chownah
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by chownah »

Voluntary simplicity; the gateway to minimalist living.
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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by Modus.Ponens »

daverupa wrote:
appicchato wrote:
I thought it was awesome.

List of things he doesn't have (out of the top of my head):
bed,
books,
cds,
dvds,
shelves,
more than one minimum cooking/eating set,
nightstands,
sheets,
pillow cases,
endless old medicine
TV.
Right there with the millions of homeless and displaced...and (dare one say) hundreds of millions very nearby...
Yes, yes. Yes.
I don't get the point.
'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' - Jhana Sutta
chownah
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by chownah »

Does living minimally make one a better person?
Does being a better person mean you will be a more minimal liver?
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Dan74
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by Dan74 »

I am guessing people are detecting some hypocrisy in professing to be minimalist and not caring for possessions while still living a privileged lifestyle when many don't have that choice.

For my part, I think it's a step in the right direction. Consuming less is good for the environment and a good example to all. Whether the guy in the video thought he was something special or just a guy who was sincerely trying to orient himself away from the material, I don't know, but I hope the latter, and I think that's a good step.

I have few possessions apart from my hobby, photography, where I have a positively obscene amount of equipment. Trying cull the excess over the next few weeks...
_/|\_
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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by Modus.Ponens »

Dan74 wrote:I am guessing people are detecting some hypocrisy in professing to be minimalist and not caring for possessions while still living a privileged lifestyle when many don't have that choice.

For my part, I think it's a step in the right direction. Consuming less is good for the environment and a good example to all. Whether the guy in the video thought he was something special or just a guy who was sincerely trying to orient himself away from the material, I don't know, but I hope the latter, and I think that's a good step.

I have few possessions apart from my hobby, photography, where I have a positively obscene amount of equipment. Trying cull the excess over the next few weeks...
If that is the point I'm missing it's because that doesn't contradict at all the point he is making of living with the fewest possessions.

The point he is making is that possessing a thing is a burden. Using a thing is not. The only thing he is doing is geting rid of the burden to focus on what he thinks are important aspects of life. So he doesn't live in a cave? What do we know about what he does with the extra money he earns? Maybe he gives it, or maybe not. That's a lateral question. The video was making two points: 1) material possessions are a burden; 2) time is our most valuable asset. I see no hypocrisy here. :shrug:

I agree that he is in the right direction.
'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' - Jhana Sutta
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contemplating
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by contemplating »

chownah wrote:Does living minimally make one a better person?
Does being a better person mean you will be a more minimal liver?
chownah
Living minimally, or simply, does not mean one will be a better person but when you start practicing and are in accord with the dhamma I think you begin to realize that there are many unnecessary possessions in this world that a person binds themselves to.
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by dagon »

contemplating wrote:
chownah wrote:Does living minimally make one a better person?
Does being a better person mean you will be a more minimal liver?
chownah
Living minimally, or simply, does not mean one will be a better person but when you start practicing and are in accord with the dhamma I think you begin to realize that there are many unnecessary possessions in this world that a person binds themselves to.
I would agree with you - but becoming a minimalist or anything else can be a problem in its self. Just be.
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by beeblebrox »

appicchato wrote:'Minimalist'?...minimalist would be not paying at least three grand a month rent on that pad...
Sam Vara wrote:Agreed. It reminds me a bit of John Lennon singing "Imagine no possessions" in a big pristine empty white room in his Thames-side mansion.
purple planet wrote:when i lived alone i had much less stuff then him - and i didnt try to be a minimalist and i dont think that i was
appicchato wrote:
Modus.Ponens wrote:I thought it was awesome.

List of things he doesn't have (out of the top of my head):
bed,
books,
cds,
dvds,
shelves,
more than one minimum cooking/eating set,
nightstands,
sheets,
pillow cases,
endless old medicine
TV.
Right there with the millions of homeless and displaced...and (dare one say) hundreds of millions very nearby...
Modus.Ponens wrote:
daverupa wrote: Yes, yes. Yes.
I don't get the point.
Hi Modus Ponens,

I think there's maybe a lack of awareness going on with some of the practices here, as unwholesome mindsets are playing themselves out... in the place of wholesome ones (e.g., such as mudita, or karuna, metta, or even uppekha).

I don't think it's really this guy's fault if there were people who were less fortunate, or they had no choice except to live the way that they do... nor do I think that says anything about him, nor the lifestyle that he chose.

To try to make such links (i.e., to try put it all on this guy; to try to point out what we think is his lack of efforts with these areas; or to try diminish his own efforts in contrast to these circumstances, which by the way have nothing to do with him) basically comes from a delusion.

I think we should just let other people do their own practices, from wherever they are... and hope they get some insights about it, eventually... (in their own times.)

We're all in this together.

:anjali:
Last edited by beeblebrox on Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
daverupa
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by daverupa »

Modus.Ponens wrote:I don't get the point.
Succinctly,
contemplating wrote:Living minimally, or simply, does not mean one will be a better person
---

My response is informed by lines in the Brahmajala Sutta about how living simply and so forth, as examples of potentially or actually wholesome conduct (sila), are yet "those trifling and insignificant matters, those minor details of mere moral virtue, that a worldling would refer to..."

Homeless people live even more simply, and yet they are not singled out for videos lauding that lifestyle. This guy could have walked outside with his camera and buddy and found someone within a few city blocks who had even less.

I guess the point of the video is to cheer someone who chooses such an approach, as opposed to someone who finds themselves in it through other variables, but it's such a superficial thing to get excited about...
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by DNS »

Modus.Ponens wrote:
The video was making two points: 1) material possessions are a burden; 2) time is our most valuable asset. I see no hypocrisy here. :shrug:
:thumbsup: I agree it made good points on both counts.
daverupa wrote: I guess the point of the video is to cheer someone who chooses such an approach,
I think that is the other [unstated] point. That it must be a choice. For those in poverty who have much fewer possessions than the guy in the video, who don't have a nice apartment, computer, etc. there can be a great deal of frustration and unhappiness. As people come out of poverty, the happiness levels rise significantly. And then as people get to much higher levels of wealth and income, there is a diminishing returns of happiness. And that is due to the extra burdens. Something like the image in this graph:

Image

S. N. Goenka (who recently passed and was a successful businessman) stated in one of his talks that he is glad that he reached success in business and wealth. For had he not, he might have wondered if wealth would be the best course to happiness. He said that now he knows that wealth does not bring the happiness of insight, tranquility.
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by Anagarika »

All the more reason for the very wealthy to do their part to alleviate the suffering of those without food, or proper shelter. If the wealthy understood that there was a point of diminishing returns of happiness, and that they could instill happiness in others just by parting with 5 percent of their wealth (while they themselves would become happier!) , imagine how this rising tide of compassion could "lift all boats in the lake." So many in the US rail against socialism, but so long as there are the very wealthy, and there are high numbers of children going to bed so hungry at night they cannot breathe, more needs to be done to allocate the extreme wealth this nation produces.
beeblebrox
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by beeblebrox »

daverupa wrote:
Modus.Ponens wrote:I don't get the point.
Succinctly,
contemplating wrote:Living minimally, or simply, does not mean one will be a better person
---

My response is informed by lines in the Brahmajala Sutta about how living simply and so forth, as examples of potentially or actually wholesome conduct (sila), are yet "those trifling and insignificant matters, those minor details of mere moral virtue, that a worldling would refer to..."

Homeless people live even more simply, and yet they are not singled out for videos lauding that lifestyle. This guy could have walked outside with his camera and buddy and found someone within a few city blocks who had even less.

I guess the point of the video is to cheer someone who chooses such an approach, as opposed to someone who finds themselves in it through other variables, but it's such a superficial thing to get excited about...
Hi Dave,

I don't think it's really appropriate (if ever) to try to use the Buddha's teachings as a standard to judge others with. They're only for us to practice with... they're not for people who didn't take refuge in them.

:anjali:
daverupa
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by daverupa »

beeblebrox wrote:Hi Dave,

I don't think it's really appropriate (if ever) to try to use the Buddha's teachings as a standard to judge others with. They're only for us to practice with... they're not for people who didn't take refuge in them.
This is a good point.

I did not feel that I was judging the person, however I was conveying a point in a trenchant manner, which probably counts as harsh speech.
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by Monkey Mind »

Here's another video of the same vine:
http://youtu.be/CkaH_UUH0Ek

Obviously, her motivation of seeking a "life of adventure" has nothing to do with the Dhamma. I just share because the woman in the video comes to the same conclusion: having less stuff allows for a bigger life.

(Curiously, she never mentions what she does for income.)
"As I am, so are others;
as others are, so am I."
Having thus identified self and others,
harm no one nor have them harmed.

Sutta Nipāta 3.710
chownah
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Re: Minimalist living

Post by chownah »

She has got a very very nice boat.....you can even stand up in it! What an adventure!.....camping at sea. Here's a picture of some children having the adventure of their lives (literally) camping in Sudan. Look, you can even send up in their shelters!......or at least some of them.


http://www.kulturekritic.com/2012/08/ne ... gee-camps/

chownah
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