What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

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What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby arijitmitter » Sat Nov 02, 2013 4:29 am

What would a Buddhist do when truly hurt by someone who is a very close friend or relative. If that person acts in a manner that is really hurtful.

I know the Buddhist will be silent. But how do you contain the pain and anguish you suffer? The normal way of shouting and arguing has a cathartic effect (though not perfect). We know that if pain is stored in the mind it causes real physical problems like ulcer, blood pressure and even stroke not to speak of depression.

Is there anything in scriptures. Can someone guide me how to contain pain given out by a person who is hurtful, illogical and plain mean and selfish.

(such as you go out of your way to be nice and decent to someone with a king size inferiority complex and you work at it for 25 years but they refuse to see the world through any other way than their selfish, mean spirited manner and one day when you are going through some deep problem say at office they decide to take that opportunity to turn just a little bit meaner)

:anjali: Arijit
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby Dan74 » Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:04 am

Hello Arijit :hello:

As regards scriptures, the first thing that came to my mind was Dhammapada:

"He abused me, he struck me, he overpowered me, he robbed me." Those who harbor such thoughts do not still their hatred.

4. "He abused me, he struck me, he overpowered me, he robbed me." Those who do not harbor such thoughts still their hatred.

5. Hatred is never appeased by hatred in this world. By non-hatred alone is hatred appeased. This is a law eternal.

6. There are those who do not realize that one day we all must die. But those who do realize this settle their quarrels.


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/dhp/dhp.01.budd.html

I don't think that one should necessarily stay silent after being hurt. Sometimes it is not he best course of action. Sometimes challenging the other person or at least communicating how one feels in some way, can lead to beneficial outcomes while staying silent could lead to estrangment. It all depends.

For me, the main point is pride. Letting go of pride and expectations and instead facing the situation squarely, giving 100%, engaging fully.
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby Sanjay PS » Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:06 am

arijitmitter wrote:What would a Buddhist do when truly hurt by someone who is a very close friend or relative. If that person acts in a manner that is really hurtful.

I know the Buddhist will be silent. But how do you contain the pain and anguish you suffer? The normal way of shouting and arguing has a cathartic effect (though not perfect). We know that if pain is stored in the mind it causes real physical problems like ulcer, blood pressure and even stroke not to speak of depression.

Is there anything in scriptures. Can someone guide me how to contain pain given out by a person who is hurtful, illogical and plain mean and selfish.

(such as you go out of your way to be nice and decent to someone with a king size inferiority complex and you work at it for 25 years but they refuse to see the world through any other way than their selfish, mean spirited manner and one day when you are going through some deep problem say at office they decide to take that opportunity to turn just a little bit meaner)

:anjali: Arijit


One of the ways is to observe the sensations of pain and anguish while meditating , understanding and realizing its nature of annica , and slowly letting it all evaporate , thus allowing in its place loving kindness and compassion towards the person and the situation.

It works very well , we have to give the process time and patience though .

sanjay
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby pilgrim » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:28 am

There is the Lokadhamma sutta - on the 8 worldly winds.

http://www.aimwell.org/lokadhamma.html
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby Aloka » Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:17 am

Hi arijit,

I wonder if this sutta "The Training" might be helpful...

excerpt:

Dry out that which is past, let there be nothing for you in the future. If you do not grasp at anything in the present you will go about at peace. One who, in regard to this entire mindbody complex, has no cherishing of it as 'mine,' and who does not grieve for what is non-existent truly suffers no loss in the world. For him there is no thought of anything as 'this is mine' or 'this is another's'; not finding any state of ownership, and realizing, 'nothing is mine,' he does not grieve.

"To be not callous, not greedy, at rest and unruffled by circumstances — that is the profitable result I proclaim when asked about one who does not waver. For one who does not crave, who has understanding, there is no production (of new kamma). Refraining from initiating (new kamma) he sees security everywhere. A sage does not speak in terms of being equal, lower or higher. Calmed and without selfishness he neither grasps nor rejects."

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/kn/snp/snp.4.15.irel.html



and this from Ajahn Sumedho:

...Metta, loving kindness, is an all-inclusive practice. Although liberation comes through letting go of our attachment to the conditioned world, if we concentrate on this alone we may develop an attitude which is excluding, almost annihilistic. The tendency will be to see conditions solely in terms of not being attached to them, or even trying to get rid of them. But with metta, we are relating to all conditioned experience with an attitude of kindness, accepting things as they are. Consider what this does to the mind as a practice. We contemplate all phenomena, all sentient beings, in terms of loving-kindness rather than in terms of which is best, which is worst, what we like, what we don’t like.

... Metta is non-discriminatory. It doesn't mean liking one thing rather than another, it isn't a question of singling out: "I love this person, I don't love that one." Ours is a highly critical society. We are brought up to emphasise what's wrong with ourselves, our family and friends, the government, the country, the world at large - and so we become very conscious of the negative. We see the fault in people or things and become obsessed with that, and are no longer able to see what's right about them. In practising metta, however, we deliberately avoid clinging to faults and weaknesses. We're not blind to them, we're not promoting them, rather we maintain an attitude of kindness and patience towards defects in ourselves and others.

continued:

http://www.dhammatalks.net/Books3/Ajahn_Sumedho_Universal_Loving_Kindness.htm


With kind regards,

Aloka
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby Modus.Ponens » Sat Nov 02, 2013 10:02 am

Sanjay PS wrote:
arijitmitter wrote:What would a Buddhist do when truly hurt by someone who is a very close friend or relative. If that person acts in a manner that is really hurtful.

I know the Buddhist will be silent. But how do you contain the pain and anguish you suffer? The normal way of shouting and arguing has a cathartic effect (though not perfect). We know that if pain is stored in the mind it causes real physical problems like ulcer, blood pressure and even stroke not to speak of depression.

Is there anything in scriptures. Can someone guide me how to contain pain given out by a person who is hurtful, illogical and plain mean and selfish.

(such as you go out of your way to be nice and decent to someone with a king size inferiority complex and you work at it for 25 years but they refuse to see the world through any other way than their selfish, mean spirited manner and one day when you are going through some deep problem say at office they decide to take that opportunity to turn just a little bit meaner)

:anjali: Arijit


One of the ways is to observe the sensations of pain and anguish while meditating , understanding and realizing its nature of annica , and slowly letting it all evaporate , thus allowing in its place loving kindness and compassion towards the person and the situation.

It works very well , we have to give the process time and patience though .

sanjay


Dan74 wrote:I don't think that one should necessarily stay silent after being hurt. Sometimes it is not he best course of action. Sometimes challenging the other person or at least communicating how one feels in some way, can lead to beneficial outcomes while staying silent could lead to estrangment. It all depends.

For me, the main point is pride. Letting go of pride and expectations and instead facing the situation squarely, giving 100%, engaging fully.


These two advices are connected. When you observe the sensations in meditation, without attachment or aversion, you should point to the sensations connected to hurt pride and failed expectations. Also related, let go of your need for that person's aproval and love. It's a slow process, but it will be good for you _ after all, we have to let go of everything.

Remember the story about the Buddha being verbaly abused by someone and simply replying: "I don't accept that gift"? That's the goal. Right when you start to listen to the mean stuff, imediatly let go of the need for that person's love. Then you analyse what is true and what is not true. What is true you try to change it for your own good. What is not true you just drop it.

I know this seems cold, but unattachment is not lack of kindness. And practicing metta will probably also help in loving that person in a way that is much healthier for you and said person.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby arijitmitter » Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:11 pm

All the replies are excellent. Will really not like to turn this Forum into an agony aunt column. But sometimes help from Buddha's teachings is needed in humdrum daily life.

Will read through all the given material slowly and try to pray that person is is well and happy always.

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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby SDC » Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:19 pm

arijitmitter wrote:What would a Buddhist do when truly hurt by someone who is a very close friend or relative. If that person acts in a manner that is really hurtful.

I know the Buddhist will be silent. But how do you contain the pain and anguish you suffer? The normal way of shouting and arguing has a cathartic effect (though not perfect). We know that if pain is stored in the mind it causes real physical problems like ulcer, blood pressure and even stroke not to speak of depression.

Is there anything in scriptures. Can someone guide me how to contain pain given out by a person who is hurtful, illogical and plain mean and selfish.

(such as you go out of your way to be nice and decent to someone with a king size inferiority complex and you work at it for 25 years but they refuse to see the world through any other way than their selfish, mean spirited manner and one day when you are going through some deep problem say at office they decide to take that opportunity to turn just a little bit meaner)

:anjali: Arijit


You don't have to contain the pain because you do not have to stay silent like you assume. I am curious what put that idea in the forefront as the likely "Buddhist" position. In some cases that is the worst thing you can do in a situation. Address the issue but follow the guidelines of right speech. You can be firm and honest and get your point across.


"Monks, a statement endowed with five factors is well-spoken, not ill-spoken. It is blameless & unfaulted by knowledgeable people. Which five?

"It is spoken at the right time. It is spoken in truth. It is spoken affectionately. It is spoken beneficially. It is spoken with a mind of good-will.

"A statement endowed with these five factors is well-spoken, not ill-spoken. It is blameless & unfaulted by knowledgeable people."
-AN 5.198


...He speaks the truth, holds to the truth, is firm, reliable, no deceiver of the world. Abandoning divisive speech he abstains from divisive speech. What he has heard here he does not tell there to break those people apart from these people here. What he has heard there he does not tell here to break these people apart from those people there. Thus reconciling those who have broken apart or cementing those who are united, he loves concord, delights in concord, enjoys concord, speaks things that create concord. Abandoning abusive speech, he abstains from abusive speech. He speaks words that are soothing to the ear, that are affectionate, that go to the heart, that are polite, appealing & pleasing to people at large. Abandoning idle chatter, he abstains from idle chatter. He speaks in season, speaks what is factual, what is in accordance with the goal, the Dhamma, & the Vinaya. He speaks words worth treasuring, seasonable, reasonable, circumscribed, connected with the goal. This is how one is made pure in four ways by verbal action.

From AN 10.176
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby arijitmitter » Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:39 pm

SDC wrote:I am curious what put that idea in the forefront as the likely "Buddhist" position.


Excellent question. And I have no answer.

Partly from parts of scriptures like Dhp Verse 80

Farmers channel the water;
Fletchers straighten the arrow;
Carpenters work the timber;
The Wise tame themselves.

Partly from watching quasi Buddhist films (when I was not a Buddhist; forgive me Buddha I knew not what I was doing) like "Bulletproof Monk" and "Karate Kid" (Mr Miyagi)

Partly I always thought we Buddhists were supposed to be silent when insulted, hurt, humiliated. It is a sign of maturity.

Are we not supposed to be like a rock ? Unmoved, unmoving and let slings and arrows of outrageous fortune never perturb us.

Bit like this fellow

Image

I understand it is clinging to a view - true Buddhists have to be austere, ascetic, renunciate, unperturbed. Buddhists can be jolly and funny. Ajahn Brahm laughs a lot and I love his videos.

But due to my strong clinging I always wanted to be an austere Buddhist.

post written in a lighter vein not to be taken entirely seriously
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby SDC » Sat Nov 02, 2013 4:14 pm

Proper practice is about taking action that will be beneficial for all in a given situation, not to avoid making any response whatsoever. It depends on the circumstances.There are cases where silence would be the best action, but not always. Sometimes speaking up will improve a situation.

This stoic, rock idea is far fetched - especially for the common, non-ariya practitioner. But in your defense, I will say that there are many that want to be perceived in that way, so it is no surprise you think this.
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby arijitmitter » Sat Nov 02, 2013 4:25 pm

I think people who are of the quiet type migrate to Buddhism. Introverted. By introvert I do not mean shy. I mean contemplative people who do not like large crowds.

Of course I am making a generalization. Do very extroverted people convert ? Can anyone give anecdotal evidence to throw light on this ? (not including extroverted people in a particular setting; such as a scientist maybe introvert usually but become an extrovert when attending a seminar with fellow scientists).

Any one knows of a politician (from alderman to Governor) who has converted to Buddhism in a serious manner ?
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Re: What Would A Buddhist Do When Hurt

Postby Sanjay PS » Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:22 am

arijitmitter wrote:I think people who are of the quiet type migrate to Buddhism. Introverted. By introvert I do not mean shy. I mean contemplative people who do not like large crowds.

Of course I am making a generalization. Do very extroverted people convert ? Can anyone give anecdotal evidence to throw light on this ? (not including extroverted people in a particular setting; such as a scientist maybe introvert usually but become an extrovert when attending a seminar with fellow scientists).

Any one knows of a politician (from alderman to Governor) who has converted to Buddhism in a serious manner ?



An ex-politician whom i can think of is Bill Clinton .

i think a very introverted person can actually be the opposite , and an extroverted person can be in effect be very introverted . So long as we are in tune with whats happening within us , and keep realizing how we" perceive "the outside , dependent on that what is actually happening with us at any given point of time , the definition of introverted or extroverted gets that extra bit of clarity :smile:
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