masturbation what's wrong?

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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Lazy_eye » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:49 pm

For some men, if you don't have sex and don't masturbate, your body will eventually decide to release sperm during sleep. A side effect may be vivid, erotic dreams -- which can be even more intensely pleasurable than actual sex. Although since the dreams are unintentional, I suppose they have no kammic implications.

Still, if your goal is to minimize erotic distractions, a quick wank now and then might be a relatively efficient solution. I'm just saying...
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby 000 » Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:46 am

duckfiasco wrote:Interesting thread for me to make my first post on here :) But lust has a special prominence in my practice, so I'm chiming in :thumbsup: I'm sorry for the lack of sutta quotations. I'm relatively new to Theravada after years of Zen, still getting acquainted with all the writings.

None of the intellectual sort of approaches have helped me with what is a very visceral drive, like contemplating the parts of the body, repulsiveness, unsatisfactoriness... In my opinion, masturbation may be this or that argument, but it's primarily like practicing something we already know inside and out when we could be learning something new. Should we be using this rare day we're still alive to further refine our mastery of satisfying sensual desires?

Two things have helped me. One is practicing sila in general, cultivating loving-kindness, noticing other sources of suffering like my temper, greed and working with them, being milder and more easily content. Cooling the mind down in daily life makes lust less tricky to handle.

And second, simply viewing it as not a very useful way to spend time. There's a big difference compared to other "useless" activities, like playing an instrument, reading fiction, or relaxing in the sun. I find during those kinds of things, I can remain mindful and see the aspects of dhamma in everyday things, even as the body or mind are satisfied. The mind is calmed. For me, to be able to masturbate requires doing the opposite: forgetting everything and zeroing in on a physical sensation, or a mental image. And the mind is stirred up.

Lust is samsara in a nutshell. You can almost feel on fire from needing to do this thing that by definition cannot be satisfied. And we willingly cloak ourselves in distortions and misperceptions to have a little drop of good feelings. Maybe it isn't this grandiose for others.

I've heard it said that celebate monks give up sex for something far better: a calm and joyous mind :tongue: We already know what masturbating feels like. But do we really have an intimate idea of the luminosity of a mind at ease? It may be more appealing in the heat of the moment to think "Let's try something new" than "I shouldn't X or Y".



Yeah i pretty much agree with u on all accounts. Especially where u said contemplating the parts of the body and overall unclenliness doesnt really seem to work. It will work on a mundain level but once u mentally side with the lust to jerkoff uve already somewhat agreed to fabricate on that level, thus contemplating the womens liver, intestines exposed etc..doesnt really have an effect. For example if u sit down and watch a family show like everbody loves raymod or something ur not sitting there picking apart how unrealistic the acting is and how this is a waste of time because once uv'e decided to watch it ur simultaneasly fabricatng at that level. For me i find staying with the breath and thinking of the aggregates as a seperate entities works because u realise how u are sculpting an "I" around them and how indiviually it is just form,feelings,perceptions,fabrications,and consciousness . After a while u can start to catch the requisites for lust one by one and abandon the cause right then and there. Opposed to before when lust would seem to come as a package deal that is burning and has a million justifications to make it seem "alright" . Ive stopped masterbating for about 3 days now and im not going to say im officially done with it, but what i really want to do is fully comprehend the mental snare that i set for my self that feels like u really want to masterbate but ur just repressing it and thus become a slave to aversion. It has to be uprooted and the only way is to really see the process/stress and abaondon the cause and know how u did it..which in laymens terms is essentially the 4 noble truths. Ull reach a point to where when ur watching porn u can actually see how ur creating states of becoming around it or as the buddha called it " i making and my making".
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby ricebowl » Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:05 pm

christopher::: wrote:
Ben wrote:While I don't think the Buddha addressed the issue in explicit detail, I think we can infer the morality of masturbation through what he taught us in relation to the danger inherent in indulging in sensory desires, and the operation of sankharas. I don't think its a huge deductive leap. I'm sorry I don't have any references to support my contention....


How about this?

Dhp XXIV PTS: Dhp 334-359; Tanhavagga: Craving


334. The craving of one given to heedless living grows like a creeper. Like the monkey seeking fruits in the forest, he leaps from life to life (tasting the fruit of his kamma).

335. Whoever is overcome by this wretched and sticky craving, his sorrows grow like grass after the rains.

336. But whoever overcomes this wretched craving, so difficult to overcome, from him sorrows fall away like water from a lotus leaf.

337. This I say to you: Good luck to all assembled here! Dig up the root of craving, like one in search of the fragrant root of the birana grass. Let not Mara crush you again and again, as a flood crushes a reed.

338. Just as a tree, though cut down, sprouts up again if its roots remain uncut and firm, even so, until the craving that lies dormant is rooted out, suffering springs up again and again.

339. The misguided man in whom the thirty-six currents of craving strongly rush toward pleasurable objects, is swept away by the flood of his passionate thoughts. [21]

340. Everywhere these currents flow, and the creeper (of craving) sprouts and grows. Seeing that the creeper has sprung up, cut off its root with wisdom.

341. Flowing in (from all objects) and watered by craving, feelings of pleasure arise in beings. Bent on pleasures and seeking enjoyment, these men fall prey to birth and decay.

342. Beset by craving, people run about like an entrapped hare. Held fast by mental fetters, they come to suffering again and again for a long time.

343. Beset by craving, people run about like an entrapped hare. Therefore, one who yearns to be passion-free should destroy his own craving.

344. There is one who, turning away from desire (for household life) takes to the life of the forest (i.e., of a monk). But after being freed from the household, he runs back to it. Behold that man! Though freed, he runs back to that very bondage! [22]

345-346. That is not a strong fetter, the wise say, which is made of iron, wood or hemp. But the infatuation and longing for jewels and ornaments, children and wives — that, they say, is a far stronger fetter, which pulls one downward and, though seemingly loose, is hard to remove. This, too, the wise cut off. Giving up sensual pleasure, and without any longing, they renounce the world.

347. Those who are lust-infatuated fall back into the swirling current (of samsara) like a spider on its self-spun web. This, too, the wise cut off. Without any longing, they abandon all suffering and renounce the world.

348. Let go of the past, let go of the future, let go of the present, and cross over to the farther shore of existence. With mind wholly liberated, you shall come no more to birth and death.

349. For a person tormented by evil thoughts, who is passion-dominated and given to the pursuit of pleasure, his craving steadily grows. He makes the fetter strong, indeed.

350. He who delights in subduing evil thoughts, who meditates on the impurities and is ever mindful — it is he who will make an end of craving and rend asunder Mara's fetter.

351. He who has reached the goal, is fearless, free from craving, passionless, and has plucked out the thorns of existence — for him this is the last body.

352. He who is free from craving and attachment, is perfect in uncovering the true meaning of the Teaching, and knows the arrangement of the sacred texts in correct sequence — he, indeed, is the bearer of his final body. He is truly called the profoundly wise one, the great man.

353. A victor am I over all, all have I known. Yet unattached am I to all that is conquered and known. Abandoning all, I am freed through the destruction of craving. Having thus directly comprehended all by myself, whom shall I call my teacher? [23]

354. The gift of Dhamma excels all gifts; the taste of the Dhamma excels all tastes; the delight in Dhamma excels all delights. The Craving-Freed vanquishes all suffering.

355. Riches ruin only the foolish, not those in quest of the Beyond. By craving for riches the witless man ruins himself as well as others.

356. Weeds are the bane of fields, lust is the bane of mankind. Therefore, what is offered to those free of lust yields abundant fruit.

357. Weeds are the bane of fields, hatred is the bane of mankind. Therefore, what is offered to those free of hatred yields abundant fruit.

358. Weeds are the bane of fields, delusion is the bane of mankind. Therefore, what is offered to those free of delusion yields abundant fruit.

359. Weeds are the bane of fields, desire is the bane of mankind. Therefore, what is offered to those free of desire yields abundant fruit.

"Tanhavagga: Craving" (Dhp XXIV), translated from the Pali by Acharya Buddharakkhita. Access to Insight, 23 April 2012, http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .budd.html . Retrieved on 20 September 2013.
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby brahmacharya » Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:57 pm

What's wrong?

Tell you what... Abstain from all sexual activity (both physically and mentally) for a month or two. If any sexual thoughts rise at that time, ignore them. It's best not to experience any arousal at that time. If you get mildly aroused, calm yourself before the arousal gets more intense.

After the month (or two) is finished, masturbate and pay close attention to your mind and body. You will get the answer to your question.

From the standpoint of Buddhism... it is a joke to say there's nothing wrong with masturbation or sensual pleasure when the Buddha recommended dispassion and said that desire is the cause of rebirth and suffering.

Read this:

http://brahmacharya.net/buddha-against- ... l-pleasure
Brahmacharya & Related Topics - A website about brahmacharya/celibacy, asceticism, yoga and related subjects.
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby ricebowl » Sun Nov 17, 2013 5:23 am

brahmacharya wrote:What's wrong?

Tell you what... Abstain from all sexual activity (both physically and mentally) for a month or two. If any sexual thoughts rise at that time, ignore them. It's best not to experience any arousal at that time. If you get mildly aroused, calm yourself before the arousal gets more intense.

After the month (or two) is finished, masturbate and pay close attention to your mind and body. You will get the answer to your question.

From the standpoint of Buddhism... it is a joke to say there's nothing wrong with masturbation or sensual pleasure when the Buddha recommended dispassion and said that desire is the cause of rebirth and suffering.

Read this:

http://brahmacharya.net/buddha-against- ... l-pleasure

This is where I read somewhere.

Shakyamuni Buddha and His son Rahula were beyond ordinary beings like you and I. Shakyamuni was born since day one to be capable of 7 human footsteps, while his eldest and said only son Rahula was born via magical incarnation supposedly when Shakyamuni's queen then asked him for fulfilment of her marital obligations as His wife. In other words, the Buddha and Rahula were born transcended so to speak, i.e. they could do without sex. Now this is the standpoint of Buddhism. So in the context of His Theravada followers, they had to obey austere practices the likes championed by Mahakassapa and various arahants, these practices helps them, i.e. ordinary followers subdue the innate carnality that was born within a human householder species. When Mahakassapa himself was said to be forced into marriage, it was suggested before that he and his bride put in several disciplines to prevent sexual intercourse from happening during their marriage. Unlike Shakyamuni and Rahula, the various arahants and disciples were ordinary enough to suggest that carnality is an issue troublesome enough for the Buddha to introduce strict vinaya so that He could keep his trainees in check.

Masturbation was prohibited in His sangha, it went hand in hand with their austere lifestyle.

Masturbation forms an awful householder's relationship with sexual intercourse, and civilian i.e. layity's society.

All human beings are born from one's parents' genitals via sexual copulation. In the context of a householder, masturbation serves as an alternative away from sexual intercourse. One can speak of restraints or even fasting, yet the point is that biologically and psychologically, human beings are born with reproductive organs that serve a prehistoric social purpose. The reproductive organs are where subsequent generations of human beings came from. While plants use means such as fruits that allow fresh seeds to grow from soil, human beings are an amusing breed, i.e. mammals, that only can breed from within a mother's womb via a father's genitals.

When a practitioner abstains from sexual activity over a period of 1-2 months, what that will do is regulate your bodily functions, and too I agree as being conducive towards one longer term welfare. In fact, given a choice, minus all the sensual distractions in our worldly lives, I will second that. As a teenager I held back from masturbating over a period of 6 months and also partaking in vegan diets, essentially the seminal fluid dries up somewhat and it takes a couple few more rounds of masturbation before I regained its originally yellowish texture. Learning to see one's body as a machine, organic somewhat, it is subjected to nourishment, it functions accordingly to the conditions that it is used.

Having been masturbating over long periods, it will actually please me should somebody find me better things to do than reacting to biological signs characteristic of a mammal. Is one's mother a mammal? When one's mother is a mammal, one too is. Part of spiritual endeavour requires one to be honest, frank, truthful and upfront with oneself. Pick up an elementary school science textbook and one already is educated on the life cycles. All the restraint from masturbation *and* sexual intercourse is just denying oneself of what is inevitable, i.e. having come from a womb, other beings too are trying to appear from a womb. In fact, this was the exact challenge that all of us threw at our parents when they were deliberating over procreation or abstinence. When an adult male masturbates instead of procreating with an adult female, the appearance of an embryo within a womb is deferred another day. Ignorance is still there, just as craving for eternal existence and so on, and next day the same challenge returns. Again, between masturbation or procreation, it depends on how well an adult male and adult female can regulate their natural inclinations.

When somebody finds fault with either masturbation or procreation, he/she fulfils another aspect of spiritual practice, that is he/she is just finding fault with his/her own existence, i.e. where he/she came from and how he/she came about into being. Should refraining and abstaining help one's practice in this way, by all means go ahead.

Be true with oneself.
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby mahat » Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:18 am

ricebowl wrote:
brahmacharya wrote:What's wrong?

Tell you what... Abstain from all sexual activity (both physically and mentally) for a month or two. If any sexual thoughts rise at that time, ignore them. It's best not to experience any arousal at that time. If you get mildly aroused, calm yourself before the arousal gets more intense.

After the month (or two) is finished, masturbate and pay close attention to your mind and body. You will get the answer to your question.

From the standpoint of Buddhism... it is a joke to say there's nothing wrong with masturbation or sensual pleasure when the Buddha recommended dispassion and said that desire is the cause of rebirth and suffering.

Read this:

http://brahmacharya.net/buddha-against- ... l-pleasure

This is where I read somewhere.

Shakyamuni Buddha and His son Rahula were beyond ordinary beings like you and I. Shakyamuni was born since day one to be capable of 7 human footsteps, while his eldest and said only son Rahula was born via magical incarnation supposedly when Shakyamuni's queen then asked him for fulfilment of her marital obligations as His wife. In other words, the Buddha and Rahula were born transcended so to speak, i.e. they could do without sex. Now this is the standpoint of Buddhism. So in the context of His Theravada followers, they had to obey austere practices the likes championed by Mahakassapa and various arahants, these practices helps them, i.e. ordinary followers subdue the innate carnality that was born within a human householder species. When Mahakassapa himself was said to be forced into marriage, it was suggested before that he and his bride put in several disciplines to prevent sexual intercourse from happening during their marriage. Unlike Shakyamuni and Rahula, the various arahants and disciples were ordinary enough to suggest that carnality is an issue troublesome enough for the Buddha to introduce strict vinaya so that He could keep his trainees in check.

Masturbation was prohibited in His sangha, it went hand in hand with their austere lifestyle.

Masturbation forms an awful householder's relationship with sexual intercourse, and civilian i.e. layity's society.

All human beings are born from one's parents' genitals via sexual copulation. In the context of a householder, masturbation serves as an alternative away from sexual intercourse. One can speak of restraints or even fasting, yet the point is that biologically and psychologically, human beings are born with reproductive organs that serve a prehistoric social purpose. The reproductive organs are where subsequent generations of human beings came from. While plants use means such as fruits that allow fresh seeds to grow from soil, human beings are an amusing breed, i.e. mammals, that only can breed from within a mother's womb via a father's genitals.

When a practitioner abstains from sexual activity over a period of 1-2 months, what that will do is regulate your bodily functions, and too I agree as being conducive towards one longer term welfare. In fact, given a choice, minus all the sensual distractions in our worldly lives, I will second that. As a teenager I held back from masturbating over a period of 6 months and also partaking in vegan diets, essentially the seminal fluid dries up somewhat and it takes a couple few more rounds of masturbation before I regained its originally yellowish texture. Learning to see one's body as a machine, organic somewhat, it is subjected to nourishment, it functions accordingly to the conditions that it is used.

Having been masturbating over long periods, it will actually please me should somebody find me better things to do than reacting to biological signs characteristic of a mammal. Is one's mother a mammal? When one's mother is a mammal, one too is. Part of spiritual endeavour requires one to be honest, frank, truthful and upfront with oneself. Pick up an elementary school science textbook and one already is educated on the life cycles. All the restraint from masturbation *and* sexual intercourse is just denying oneself of what is inevitable, i.e. having come from a womb, other beings too are trying to appear from a womb. In fact, this was the exact challenge that all of us threw at our parents when they were deliberating over procreation or abstinence. When an adult male masturbates instead of procreating with an adult female, the appearance of an embryo within a womb is deferred another day. Ignorance is still there, just as craving for eternal existence and so on, and next day the same challenge returns. Again, between masturbation or procreation, it depends on how well an adult male and adult female can regulate their natural inclinations.

When somebody finds fault with either masturbation or procreation, he/she fulfils another aspect of spiritual practice, that is he/she is just finding fault with his/her own existence, i.e. where he/she came from and how he/she came about into being. Should refraining and abstaining help one's practice in this way, by all means go ahead.

Be true with oneself.


I guess it all comes down to how we view ourselves doesn't it? When you look in the mirror who do you see?

An Abhassara Deva, an Arahant or a Buddha :twothumbsup: or just another human caught up in desires in this world?

Successful celibates view themselves as being higher, WHOLE beings. :D As higher beings it becomes natural for us to destroy carnal cravings and to stop engagement in propagating sexual desires and sankharas. :shrug:

Buddha wants you to see yourself as a higher being, powerful and independent not a weak person giving into base desires. :namaste:
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby ricebowl » Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:30 am

mahat wrote:I guess it all comes down to how we view ourselves doesn't it? When you look in the mirror who do you see?

An Abhassara Deva, an Arahant or a Buddha :twothumbsup: or just another human caught up in desires in this world?

Successful celibates view themselves as being higher, WHOLE beings. :D As higher beings it becomes natural for us to destroy carnal cravings and to stop engagement in propagating sexual desires and sankharas. :shrug:

Buddha wants you to see yourself as a higher being, powerful and independent not a weak person giving into base desires. :namaste:
I have been working on this for a while too. What I want to communicate across here, is that the Buddha Himself at a certain age is part of my problem. A simple analogy will explain the simplicity of the question that I have - the Buddha parinirvannaed 2500 years ago or more, He passed on at around 80 years old. Now there are certain things in his teachings where He cajoled followers especially layity to just stick with the Noble Eightfold Path instead of asking questions, or in His explanation, "Ain't conducive towards the goal".

So you see, in determining what the said goal is, labels have been introduced together with dharma, there are teminologies such as nirvana, arahant, buddha, parinirvana, just to name a few that are accepted within the Theravadin linage. If I have to go through basic definitions, what nirvana is for instance?

Nirvana is probably something to be experienced and felt when one leads a holy life, I'm alright with this.
Buddha is the first guy who experienced and felt this nirvana.
Arahant is somebody who experienced this nirvana after the Buddha did, with His guidance, or in the case of one without His Guidance that's a Paccekabuddha.
Parinirvana is just death. He lay down on a bunch of wood, His pals set Him on fire, He took a while more than necessary until Mahakassapa came by, then the wood burned by itself. That was it.

As ironic as it seems, my attempts in reconciling with basic precepts such as whether masturbation was okay or not, brought me to a point when all I found cheeky was whether does it matter that anybody's death is called a parinirvanna or just as the layperson's term went: "Death is just death".

Between two labels "parinirvanna" and "death" the question whether masturbation is wrong, wow apparently 7 billion human beings have that question.. I just learned that masturbation is a unisexual activity, i.e. girls do it, boys do it. I refuse to touch further on this new learning that I just had, I think being open is quite important. These days I find that being an "open" being is more important than being "higher".

I was brought up over 20-30 years thinking that I have to become higher beings. Somebody a perfectionist Buddhist in the house tore my exam script when I got 99 out of 100 as a child.

When a perfectionist Buddhist tries to nuture another into a perfectionist Buddhist, it turns out that there are two Buddhists without a job instead of one. Back to the same topic about the "goal" then. The primary goal of nirvanna, Buddhahood, arahantship, and at 80 years old parinirvanna. The "goal" of Buddhist teachings is the same as the eventual outcome of all 7 billion human beings on this planet whether you like that outcome or not, it's just a different name.

Parnirvanna versus death, I can neither prove beyond reasonable doubt that the parinirvanned Higher Being didn't return to samsara, nor can I prove beyond reasonable doubt that the dead ordinary being didn't live his/her final existence.

And it has been 48 years since I had a new legal ruling party in my country, 32 years since I had a new legal parent in my family.

When dukkha, anatta, and anicca are the main characteristics in Buddhism.. carnality is where 7 billion human beings came from. Try telling me how else the forumers at Dhammawheel can come from.

I live in a country where birth rates are so low that my government says that
I have given the job to another generation of leaders.” — Lee Kuan Yew

See more at: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/world ... DdeiC.dpuf


I'll start another thread on this issue of birth rates, I think on the topic of masturbation I have said enough..
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby kmath » Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:04 pm

It's funny how people get so fixated on sex and masterbation. As far as I know, Buddha only encouraged celibacy among monks and nuns.
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Babadhari » Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:44 pm

am i mistaken in believing that 'sexual misconduct' is the same as 'unneccesary sexual conduct'?
maturbation by its nature is an entirely selfish act.

if one was practicing mindfullness would the act of masturbation become unfinishable due to the loss of sexual arousal?
Aflame with the fire of passion, the fire of aversion, the fire of delusion.
Aflame, with birth, aging & death, with sorrows, lamentations, pains, distresses, & despairs ......

Seeing thus, the disciple of the Noble One grows disenchanted. SN 35.28
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Thu Nov 28, 2013 11:25 pm

kitztack wrote:am i mistaken in believing that 'sexual misconduct' is the same as 'unneccesary sexual conduct'?
maturbation by its nature is an entirely selfish act.
Who says it is unnecessary? It is no more, or less, unnecessary -- or selfish -- than eating a piece of pie.

if one was practicing mindfullness would the act of masturbation become unfinishable due to the loss of sexual arousal?
Let us know how that works out for you.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby clw_uk » Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:23 am

kmath wrote:It's funny how people get so fixated on sex and masterbation. As far as I know, Buddha only encouraged celibacy among monks and nuns.



He did but yet I don't see "jerking off" as being the 9th factor of the path ;)

The easiest way to be detached is to be celibate
“ Your mind is likewise blocked. But the right road awaits you still. Cast out your doubts, your fears and your desires, let go of grief and of hope as well, for where these rule , then the mind is their subject." Boetius
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Goofaholix » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:02 am

tiltbillings wrote:Who says it is unnecessary? It is no more, or less, unnecessary -- or selfish -- than eating a piece of pie.


Nobody died from lack of masturbation, whereas lack of food will eventually cause death. But yes of course pies specifically (as opposed to food in general) are just as unnecessary as masturbation, in asia for example people often go for a lifetime without them.
"Proper effort is not the effort to make something particular happen. It is the effort to be aware and awake each moment." - Ajahn Chah
"When we see beyond self, we no longer cling to happiness. When we stop clinging, we can begin to be happy." - Ajahn Chah
"Know and watch your heart. It’s pure but emotions come to colour it." — Ajahn Chah
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby mario92 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:48 am

Hi i want to confess to you buddhist followers of the 5 precepts that i masturbate today, i feel guilty and with pain and shame but how to recover? I think it takes a lot to the body to rest and the mind to follow virtue. What is yoir advice?
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:59 am

mario92 wrote:Hi i want to confess to you buddhist followers of the 5 precepts that i masturbate today, i feel guilty and with pain and shame but how to recover? I think it takes a lot to the body to rest and the mind to follow virtue. What is yoir advice?
Do not make a big deal about this, since it is not a big deal. The precepts are not commandments; rather, they are rules of training. They are a way of practice by which you learn about yourself. The precepts should not be used to berate yourself. You learn, slowly, being kind and compassionate towards yourself as you do. Sex (including masturbation) for the lay person is NOT prohibited, but it is something to be understood.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby mario92 » Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:19 am

hi and thank you tiltbillings, i dont know it would be necesary but for now may i control myself and dont waste my energies in that. Thank you for the advice :smile:
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby tiltbillings » Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:35 am

mario92 wrote:hi and thank you tiltbillings, i dont know it would be necesary but for now may i control myself and dont waste my energies in that. Thank you for the advice :smile:
Don't get into a struggle with yourself trying to control yourself. Simply pay attention. Watch what leads to your wanting to self pleasure yourself. The earlier you catch that the easier it is to redirect yourself to doing something else. But if you do self pleasure yourself, it is not a failure. Pay attention and see what it that you can learn about yourself. Be kind and compassionate to yourself.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.

"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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tiltbillings
 
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby ricebowl » Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:34 am

tiltbillings wrote:
mario92 wrote:hi and thank you tiltbillings, i dont know it would be necesary but for now may i control myself and dont waste my energies in that. Thank you for the advice :smile:
Don't get into a struggle with yourself trying to control yourself. Simply pay attention. Watch what leads to your wanting to self pleasure yourself. The earlier you catch that the easier it is to redirect yourself to doing something else. But if you do self pleasure yourself, it is not a failure. Pay attention and see what it that you can learn about yourself. Be kind and compassionate to yourself.


In a certain age like today metta is what the Buddha prescribed.
Being kind to oneself, being kind to others, I think that's important.
Sometimes being kind to one's parents/elders can be quite challenging, more challenging than being kind to oneself.
You notice how in the most basic theravada metta sutra the highest order is about not being born again in a womb.
In a nutshell, being born in a womb is suffering, being born *again* in a womb is even more suffering.
You see the thing is I started off being born in a womb this life, from the very moment I was born I knew just suffering.
Along with suffering came other issues like poverty, hardship, all the way till things like national wars and natural disasters.
In other words I know there is suffering, it made sense when the Buddha reiterated it, it's pleasurable when somebody says something agreeable conducive towards what I was experiencing. Then he said there was a prospect of enlightenment/nirvana.
I'm telling you, I will like to eat a milk cow.
There's nothing kind or compassionate about eating a milk cow, yet since I was a baby my family said I must not eat cows. Years have passed and I never ate a single beef patty knowingly.
Again I'm telling you, I will like to make a human baby.
There's nothing kind or compassionate about making a human baby, yet since I was a baby my family said I must not make babies, too. Years have passed and I never made a single fertilised egg knowingly.

Eating a milk cow so that we have yet another a human baby.
Sometimes I just wonder..

Is it that difficult .. or more so .. imho I have got a problem/trouble that doesn't seem worth solving by myself, I have little clue how you can help.

I bring back the Kalama Sutta which is where I began exploring Theravadin teachings. If I make a baby or eat a cow it has gotta be conducive i.e. beneficial towards the welfare of one and all, that's when it's meaningful. If I have gotta eat a cow in order to make a baby, I rather keep a cow alive BECAUSE I love cows more than babies!

On the issue of masturbation again.. what's wrong?
What is wrong-er than masturbation, is billing a Buddhist practitioner when he needs a helping hand with ejaculation, and then making Ananda confess about whorehouses in front of a Buddhist assembly and using it to teach an entire Mahayana Sutra that complicates matters more complex than teaching Rahula how to masturbate in a toilet.
Do you understand why it's necessary that the Buddha pari nirvana, or with a cruder phrase "pass away" at 79 or so?

Rahula needed to masturbate, Ananda needed a whore, how do you want these two young men back then to quarrel with a Buddha about it?
ricebowl
 
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Ben » Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:52 am

ricebowl wrote:Rahula needed to masturbate, Ananda needed a whore, how do you want these two young men back then to quarrel with a Buddha about it?


Really?
I suppose you have textual evidence of the above?
if so, please present it.
Thanks.
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725


Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com
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Ben
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby ricebowl » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:06 am

Ben wrote:
ricebowl wrote:Rahula needed to masturbate, Ananda needed a whore, how do you want these two young men back then to quarrel with a Buddha about it?


Really?
I suppose you have textual evidence of the above?
if so, please present it.
Thanks.

Without respect lost, answering a question with questions:

How do I have textual evidence of myself masturbating?
How do I have textual evidence of you masturbating?
How do I have textual evidence of them masturbating?
How do I have textual evidence of any living being in the world masturbating?
How do I have textual evidence of myself masturbating?

How do I have videographic evidence of myself masturbating?
How do I have videographic evidence of you masturbating?
How do I have videographic evidence of them masturbating?
How do I have videographic evidence of any living being in the world masturbating?
How do I have videographic evidence of myself masturbating?

Do I know a monetary transaction when I see it?
Do I know a sexual intercourse when I see it?
Do I know a social interaction when I see it?

Do I know exertion when I see it?
Do I see my own exertion?
Do I know infliction when I see it?
Do I see my own infliction?
Do I know satisfaction when I see it?
Do I see my own satisfaction?

Do I know erection when I see it?
Do I see my own erection?
Do I know masturbation when I see it?
Do I see my own masturbation?
Do I know satisfaction when I see it?
Do I see my own satisfaction?

Do I know expression when I see it?
Do I see my own expression?
Do I know affliction when I see it?
Do I see my own affliction?
Do I know satisfaction when I see it?
Do I see my own satisfaction?

The Buddha didn't seem particularly concerned whether I was masturbating or otherwise, and the who/what/when/where/why/how/which masturbation happens.
Likewise a lay follower such as "me" doesn't seem particularly concerned how others are masturbating or otherwise, and the who/what/when/where/why/how/which masturbation happens.

The point is I am taught asking questions because a question serves a purpose; "what did you had for breakfast this morning", I took a look at my faeces this morning and it was olive drab in colour, an amusing change in colour tones when it was regularly dark brown. I asked myself "what did i had for breakfast this morning" i realise i had taken vermicelli with popiah, vegan meat, some vegetables that included lettuce and cabbage iirc, now the thing is why do I remember this? There is this cause, there is this effect. Now bring in karma again, i do this i get that, i don't do this i don't get that, which is fine. I ate vegan, I pooped olive drab poop, on other days I ate poultry, I pooped dark brown faeces. I seem to be what I eat from my head to my feet, and when that happens I say wow I can see samsara and karma in a human being itself without having supernatural powress.

Now what's wrong with masturbation again?
Why does a forum administrator ask me about evidence of masturbation?
Now what's wrong with masturbation again?
ricebowl
 
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Postby Ben » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:33 am

Ricebowl,
I don't give a rat's arse about your sex life.
If you read my question to you, I wanted you to indicate whether you have textual evidence in the tipitaka or commentarial literature of your contention that I highlighted and quoted above.
Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.

Taṃ nadīhi vijānātha:
sobbhesu padaresu ca,
saṇantā yanti kusobbhā,
tuṇhīyanti mahodadhī.

Sutta Nipata 3.725


Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR
Buddhist Life Stories of Australia

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com
User avatar
Ben
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Location: Land of the sleeping gods

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