What's the point of jhana?

[Anagarika]

For this reason I think the rendering of "Jhāyatha, bhikkhave!" as "Bhikkhus, go do jhāna!" is apt to be tendentious and misleading, inasmuch as the noun jhāna will be likely to be construed in the narrower of the two senses when in fact it's the broader one that is more often intended.

Thank you, Ven. Dhammanando, for this explanation; this clarifies the issue for me. I'm always appreciative when you weigh in on questions here at DW. I'm still left with questions as to why the broader sense or use of jhana is not more prevalent in modern Theravada. It seems relegated to a "specialty practice," and in the west, it's been displaced to some degree by former Thai Bhikkhus who now teach insight/vipassana without much mention of jhana, if any at all. Of course, Ven. Thanissaro and others (Ven. Gunaratana, Ven. Bodhi, Ven. Brahm) teach it as a core course, but a cursory glance of many Buddhist seminars neglect it almost completely. My local (United States) Theravada temple makes only rare mention of it, and does not incorporate it into the teachings to the laity there.

Taken the way that Ven. Thanissaro uses it... "The word he uses for going to meditate is “to go do jhana”—jhayati is the verb in Pali. It’s a homonym with a verb for burning, as when a flame burns steadily. And the same verb is used for doing jhana. As you practice concentration, you try to make the mind burn steadily, with a clean, clear flame. Flames that flicker up and down are hard to read by, but a steady flame is one you can read by clearly. That’s the quality you’re trying to develop so that you can read the mind" ...the definition resonates nicely. I also have this sense that the piti and sukha that can be generated in jhana complements the eradication of attachment to the sense fetters that bind us to samsara. In other words, if we are working to free ourselves from these attachments to sensuality, why not integrate a practice daily that affords a supermundane form of pleasure? If western insight teachers are teaching detachment from sense fetters, why not teach jhana as an antidote?

[mikenz66]

I'm still left with questions as to why the broader sense or use of jhana is not more prevalent in modern Theravada. It seems relegated to a "specialty practice," and in the west, it's been displaced to some degree by former Thai Bhikkhus who now teach insight/vipassana without much mention of jhana, if any at all. Of course, Ven. Thanissaro and others (Ven. Gunaratana, Ven. Bodhi, Ven. Brahm) teach it as a core course, but a cursory glance of many Buddhist seminars neglect it almost completely. My local (United States) Theravada temple makes only rare mention of it, and does not incorporate it into the teachings to the laity there.

I think that it depends on who you talk/read/listen to, and how you interpret it. What Ven Thanissaro discusses seems to me to be basically the same as what most Mahasi-based teachers teach (U Pandita uses the term "Vipassana Jhana" for non-absorbed samadhi: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pesala/Pan ... hanas.html), so that probably covers quite a lot of teachers. Many such teachers do discuss absorbed jhana (e.g. http://buddhanet.net/vmed_1.htm), but point out that it is not easy to achieve without relatively long retreats. The Goenaka-style body-scanning is another approach that gives strong non-absorbed concentration. And of course Pa Auk Sayadaw and his students teach absorbed jhana, similar to Ajahn Brahm.

I think that what particular teachers teach depends on what they find works for their students in their particular circumstances. It would be fruitless to teach absorbed jhana to casual students who turn up occasionally, for example. Also, just because they teach in a particular way doesn't mean that they are not knowledgeable about other approaches, and won't help you with those if you show interest and dedication.


Mike

[Dhammanando]

I'm not sure about this second interpretation because in the suttas the absorption factors are described quite explicitly. But if this analysis is correct, which sense of jhana would you say applies to fullfilling samma samadhi?

“And what, friends, is right concentration? Here, quite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unwholesome states, a bhikkhu enters upon and abides in the first absorption (jhāna), which is accompanied by applied and sustained thought, with rapture and pleasure born of seclusion. With the stilling of applied and sustained thought, he enters upon and abides in the second absorption (jhāna) ... etc.”

Here ‘jhāna’ in its narrow sense is identified with sammāsamādhi.

______________________________

“Jhāyatha, bhikkhave, mā pamādattha!”
“Bhikkhus, meditate, don’t be negligent!”

In this context ‘jhāyatha’ (the verb concerned usually with jhāna in its broader sense) is glossed in the commentaries as “samathañca vipassanañca vaḍḍhetha!” — “Make calm and insight grow!” Here sammāsamādhi is included within ‘jhāna’.

In Dhammapada 372 we have an example of the noun ‘jhāna’ in its broad sense:

“There is no meditation (jhāna) for one who is without wisdom, no wisdom for one who is not meditating (ajhāyato). He in whom there are meditation (jhāna) and wisdom, is indeed close to nibbāna.”
(translation: K.R. Norman)

[Mkoll]

The experience of jhana is incomparably peaceful and sublime. With the wisdom one has developed, one sees that even the most peaceful and sublime states are impermanent and conditioned. One's mind becomes "disgusted" even with jhana and one directs the mind to the deathless, Nibbana.

So wisdom is dependent on the experience of jhana?

I would agree with Ven. Bodhi (from the article that cooran posted) that jhana is necessary for the higher stages of wisdom, namely that of non-returning and arahantship. The evidence for this is the sutta I quoted as well as thinking about it thus: if the non-returner has completely eradicated sensual desire, that presupposes attainment of jhana because the Buddha said that until one has attained jhana, one does not know if a pleasure higher than sensual pleasures and thus one is in constant danger of being swept up in the flood of sensual desire. The non-returner severs that fetter by jhana and seeing with wisdom things as they truly are.

I think we regular people can and definitely should still develop wisdom independent of jhana. The wisdom may be conditioned but it is this conditioned volution that leads to the unconditioned. We must use the conditioned to eventually "reach" the unconditioned. Again, the limitations of language ensure that whenever one talks about "conditioned" and "unconditioned", confusion will result if one takes the labels too seriously so please don't this kind of talk too seriously.

The map is not the territory.

[Dhammanando]

I'm still left with questions as to why the broader sense or use of jhana is not more prevalent in modern Theravada.

I think modern teachers' choice of words is influenced by the fact that in the texts the Suttas' 'bhāvanā' and the Atthakathās' 'kammaṭṭhāna' are used far more often than than the noun 'jhāna' in its broad sense. An additional reason, specific to Thailand, is that the noun 'chaan' (Thai pronunciation of 'jhāna') is popularly associated with the sort of trance states that mediums and shamans go into. And so some teachers will avoid the word jhāna because they want to distance themselves from such déclassé associations.

[serg_o]

What is the purpose of developing jhana in the context of the 8-fold path?
...
As a starting point I'd like to observe that samma samadhi is defined in terms of jhana.
...

I'll add one more quote:

The Blessed One said: "Develop concentration, monks. A concentrated monk discerns in line with what has come into being. And what does he discern in line with what has come into being? The origination & disappearance of form. The origination & disappearance of feeling... perception... fabrications. The origination & disappearance of consciousness.

Bhagavā etadavoca: Samādhiṃ bhikkhave, bhāvetha. Samāhito bhikkhave, bhikkhu yathābhūtaṃ pajānāti. Kiñca yathābhūtaṃ pajānāti? Rūpassa samudayañca atthagamañca, vedanāya samudayañca atthagamañca, saññāya samudayañca atthagamañca, saṃkhārānaṃ samudayañca atthagamañca, viññāṇassa samudayañca atthagamañca.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html