What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

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What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby EmptyCittas1by1 » Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:07 am

I'm reading in some places that wrong-practice leads to "neurosis". Even after reading wikipedia, my understanding is dull. Is it an outlook on life? A view? An obsession? A mental illness? How does wrong-practice lead to it?
"Eat little! Sleep little! Speak little! Whatever it may be of worldly habit, lessen them, go against their power. Don't just do as you like, don't indulge in your thought. Stop this slavish following. You must constantly go against the stream of ignorance. This is called "Discipline." When you discipline your heart, it becomes very dissatisfied and begins to struggle. It becomes restricted and oppressed. When the heart is prevented from doing what it wants to do, it starts wandering and struggling. Suffering becomes apparent to us."

— Ajahn Chah
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby Mkoll » Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:01 am

That term can be used very broadly. If it's not defined specifically and properly in its context, I would be wary.

The following is an excerpt from an article called How Many of These Ridiculous "Disorders" Do YOU Suffer From? and it describes some of the neuroses in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) 4. We're on Version 5 now. It's the mental disorder "bible".

Do you have difficulty sleeping after drinking coffee? The problem isn’t a product of your poor judgment in guzzling java immediately before retiring. You are a victim of 292.89 -- Caffeine-Induced Sleep Disorder F15.8. If you reflect on your shyness while tossing and turning, the problem could be the epidemic of 300.23 -- Social Phobia F40.1. Don’t worry. Drug treatment is available.

Unfortunately, if you’re thinking about your place in the cosmos or spiritual issues, you’ve got V62.89 -- Religious or Spiritual Problem Z71.8, and I couldn’t locate a drug for that.

Bad parenting is about to become a thing of the past. It’s not your fault, or your child’s fault. Besides the ubiquitous pandemic of ADHD, there are other disorders you may not be aware of.

Your ill-behaving child may be suffering from 313.81 -- Oppositional Defiant Disorder F91.3. If your child often argues with adults, loses their temper, deliberately annoys people, etc., you’re dealing with ODD. Of course, this must be differentiated from 312.8 -- Conduct Disorder F91.8, and 312.9 -- Disruptive Behavior Disorder Not Otherwise Specified F91.9.

Should the problem be getting along with a brother or sister, the condition is V61.8 -- Sibling Relational Problem F93.3. And should you argue with your spouse about whether the child should be grounded or drugged, you might be looking down the barrel of V61.1 -- Partner Relational Problem Z63.0.

If math homework is a challenge, be sure to check for 315.1 -- Mathematics Disorder F81.2. You must be careful not to confuse this with a V62.3 -- Academic Problem Z55.8. If things are OK in the math department, but you have a teen experiencing uncertainty about life goals, career preferences, values, loyalties, etc., you’re dealing with 313.82 Identity Problem F93.8. This has been downgraded from a “disorder” in DSM-III-R, to a mere “problem” in DSM-IV. I’ll bet that makes you feel better.


I guess according to what I've emphasized, we've all got neuroses and should go see shrinks right away! :rolleye:

:anjali:
Peace,
James
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby Aloka » Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:48 am

EmptyCittas1by1 wrote:I'm reading in some places that wrong-practice leads to "neurosis"


Could you provide some examples with links please ?

.
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby EmptyCittas1by1 » Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:35 pm

Aloka wrote:
EmptyCittas1by1 wrote:I'm reading in some places that wrong-practice leads to "neurosis"


Could you provide some examples with links please ?

.


Mainly threads here on Dhammwheel

people can enjoy the sexual act, within a committed relationship with a loving partner, without it destroying them or becoming the foundation of neurosis


I'm simply saying that refraining from dinner, at least out in public in front of laypeople, isn't really relevant in today's world, at least outside Theravada countries where people maybe become emotionally compromised seeing a monk eat past noon (meanwhile they're testing out their new amulets on chickens).

We don't need that kind of neurosis in western countries.


Throughout my hole practice I'd been trying to put my emotions aside by the mean of the 8 precepts, so how could I even get insight to my emotions ? Instead I only developped some kind of neurosis along with headaches due to my metaphysical theories.


This one makes me think it's just a joke:
what actually is reborn at death???????
In the words of someone infamous, (depends on who you're asking...), just this: neurosis
"Eat little! Sleep little! Speak little! Whatever it may be of worldly habit, lessen them, go against their power. Don't just do as you like, don't indulge in your thought. Stop this slavish following. You must constantly go against the stream of ignorance. This is called "Discipline." When you discipline your heart, it becomes very dissatisfied and begins to struggle. It becomes restricted and oppressed. When the heart is prevented from doing what it wants to do, it starts wandering and struggling. Suffering becomes apparent to us."

— Ajahn Chah
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby Justsit » Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:57 pm

A working definition of neurosis as identified in psychiatry:

A psychological state characterized by excessive anxiety or insecurity without evidence of neurologic or other organic disease, sometimes accompanied by defensive or immature behaviors.

In Buddhist terms, a type of unwholesome behavior; dullness, self-centeredness
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby EmptyCittas1by1 » Thu Jan 16, 2014 2:20 am

Justsit wrote:A working definition of neurosis as identified in psychiatry:

A psychological state characterized by excessive anxiety or insecurity without evidence of neurologic or other organic disease, sometimes accompanied by defensive or immature behaviors.

In Buddhist terms, a type of unwholesome behavior; dullness, self-centeredness


Would it be like blindly following the teachings and living heedlessly while deluding yourself into thinking you're practicing? What would a neurotic person be like?
"Eat little! Sleep little! Speak little! Whatever it may be of worldly habit, lessen them, go against their power. Don't just do as you like, don't indulge in your thought. Stop this slavish following. You must constantly go against the stream of ignorance. This is called "Discipline." When you discipline your heart, it becomes very dissatisfied and begins to struggle. It becomes restricted and oppressed. When the heart is prevented from doing what it wants to do, it starts wandering and struggling. Suffering becomes apparent to us."

— Ajahn Chah
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby Justsit » Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:53 am

EmptyCittas1by1 wrote:Would it be like blindly following the teachings and living heedlessly while deluding yourself into thinking you're practicing?

No, that's simply deluding yourself = delusion. Neurosis is not the same as delusion.

The term "neurosis" covers a lot of different types of behaviors. A person may have a wide range of obsessive-compulsive disorders, do repetitive actions that have no real purpose, become anxious for no real reason, have phobias, or many other symptoms. Some of these behaviors are well hidden and not exhibited in public, so it's hard to say who is and who is not neurotic. Suffice it to say, most people exhibit some neurotic tendencies. Here's a list:

anxiety, sadness or depression, anger, irritability, mental confusion, low sense of self-worth, etc., behavioral symptoms such as phobic avoidance, vigilance, impulsive and compulsive acts, lethargy, etc., cognitive problems such as unpleasant or disturbing thoughts, repetition of thoughts and obsession, habitual fantasizing, negativity and cynicism, etc. Interpersonally, neurosis involves dependency, aggressiveness, perfectionism, schizoid isolation, socio-culturally inappropriate behaviors, etc.

And actually, the term "neurosis" is no longer used in professional psychiatric diagnosis.
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Re: What is this "neurosis" I keep seeing?

Postby SarathW » Thu Jan 16, 2014 4:05 am

Very good video about anxiety.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-wyyrXyEP8
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