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IVF - Dhamma Wheel

IVF

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
SarathW
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IVF

Postby SarathW » Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:56 am

I think destroying an embryo is unethical.

What are your thoughts about the following statement.

Ajahn Brahm:
Conclusion: embryos outside of a mother’s womb are not
reckoned as human life, and thus the ethical considerations
specific to human beings do not apply.

Last paragraph:

http://www.stefan.gr/buddhism/books/aja ... -begin.pdf
:thinking:
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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James the Giant
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Re: IVF

Postby James the Giant » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:09 am

An embryo is defined by Ajahn Brahm as younger than 8 weeks since conception.
After that it's a fetus. To be clear, Ajahn Brahm is taking ONLY about embryos in this article, younger than 8 weeks.
Then,
saturated with joy,
you will put an end to suffering and stress.

culaavuso
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Re: IVF

Postby culaavuso » Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:20 am



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cooran
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Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: IVF

Postby cooran » Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:46 am

This thread in the Classical sub-forum may be of interest:

Abortion Sources
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=17159&p=245253

With metta,
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
---It's not what happens to you in life that is important ~ it's what you do with it ---

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beeblebrox
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Re: IVF

Postby beeblebrox » Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:21 pm


Bakmoon
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Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:12 pm

In my humble opinion, the whole issue revolves around one basic question: Does an embryo possess vinnana? If it does posses vinnana, then of course, disposing of it is wrong, and if it doesn't, then doing so can't be defined as killing.

I take the position that an embryo cannot possess vinnana prior to the differentiation of tissue at 4 weeks. I am of this opinion because vinnana arises in dependence on the six fold sense base, and prior to the differentiation of tissue, there is no six fold sense base, so how could there be vinnana present in an embryo at that stage?

After 4 weeks you have a crude nervous system beginning to form, so I think you could have a very basic kind of vinnana arising, so destroying the embryo at that point would be killing.

Again, that's just my opinion, and I am looking forward to other arguments either way.
The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

culaavuso
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Joined: Sat Jan 11, 2014 8:27 pm

Re: IVF

Postby culaavuso » Wed Apr 02, 2014 5:21 pm



Bakmoon
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Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:38 pm

The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

Bakmoon
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:55 pm

A quick point of clarification: When I say that consciousness is dependent on the sixfold sense base I am not specifically referring to the twelve links of dependent origination, but more generally saying that consciousness is causally dependent on the sixfold sense base. I don't think this particular point is controversial as the sixfold consciousness is consistently depicted in the Suttas as occurring as part of contact, which is definitely dependent on the sixfold sense base.
The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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daverupa
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Re: IVF

Postby daverupa » Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm


Bakmoon
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:57 pm

The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

culaavuso
Posts: 1363
Joined: Sat Jan 11, 2014 8:27 pm

Re: IVF

Postby culaavuso » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:29 pm



Bakmoon
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:08 am

The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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daverupa
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Re: IVF

Postby daverupa » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:20 am


Bakmoon
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Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:14 pm

Re: IVF

Postby Bakmoon » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:21 am

The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

suwapan
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:54 pm

Re: IVF

Postby suwapan » Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:06 am


SarathW
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Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: IVF

Postby SarathW » Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:48 pm

Hi Suwapan
What about identical twins?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Ananda26
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 2:41 pm

Re: IVF

Postby Ananda26 » Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:45 pm

Abstaining from killing, the first precepts applies to human beings, fetuses, and embryos.

suwapan
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Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:54 pm

Re: IVF

Postby suwapan » Sat May 24, 2014 1:28 am



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