How does "the knowing" in Thai Forest Tratidion relate to this? To my understanding, it seems to be a "constant" knower that's always there, even the sight, sound, smell, taste, touch, mental formation comes and goes. The sounds comes and goes, but the knowing is always there. Knowing that the sound is there, and knowing that the sound has gone. Sounds like the concept of buddha's nature, or the unborn in zen.