YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

Is gravity impermanent - Dhamma Wheel

Is gravity impermanent

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
salaatti
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 4:42 pm

Is gravity impermanent

Postby salaatti » Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:34 pm

Hey, I have understood from buddhist teaching that everything is impermanent and actually nothing is same for even two seconds. But science has showed that gravity is always the same. Or actually it may be that space and universe will rip a part, but still gravity has been same for billions of years.

Is here any scientist on the forum who would like to comment on this,

thanks

Sanghamitta
Posts: 1614
Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:21 am
Location: By the River Thames near London.

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby Sanghamitta » Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:46 pm

Salaati, The Buddhist teaching is that things are impermanant, and also that things arise when the conditions for their existence arise. When conditions for things cease to be ,those things no longer come into being. So when the conditions for gravity exist, gravity also exists. When those conditions no longer exist, there is no gravity. Gravity is dependent on mass. No mass, no gravity. Objects with mass are themselves impermanant.its not that gravity is somehow floating around even when there are no objects with mass. When there is an object with mass gravity arises. The same with us actually. When conditions for our existence arise we exist. When those conditions no longer exist neither do we. Gravity, clouds ,mountains, people, worlds, are all arising in dependence on conditions.
The going for refuge is the door of entrance to the teachings of the Buddha.

Bhikku Bodhi.

vitellius
Posts: 190
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:21 pm

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby vitellius » Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:07 pm

There are arupa (non-material) worlds according to suttas; there is no matter in such worlds. And from time to time the Universe collapses with only arupa plane left. So we may speculate that there is no gravity at that time :)

dustyzafu
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:33 pm

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby dustyzafu » Mon Sep 14, 2009 5:56 pm


User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby Cittasanto » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:00 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

User avatar
pink_trike
Posts: 1130
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby pink_trike » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:35 am

Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

dustyzafu
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:33 pm

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby dustyzafu » Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:06 am


salaatti
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 4:42 pm

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby salaatti » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:30 am

oh, thanks guys. I had understood that gravity is a kind of field in the universe.

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby Cittasanto » Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:57 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

mudra
Posts: 51
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:33 am

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby mudra » Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:29 am

I always understood the teaching to be "all composite phenomena/things are impermanent". Which is a little different from "everything" is impermanent. Impermanent in this contexty would be "constantly changing" whereas permanent is not so much eternal as not changing for the duration of its existence. E.g. the lack of true self of a person doesn't change for as long as the person exists.

User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby jcsuperstar » Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:53 am

nibbana is permanent too, so not everything is impermanent
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

Paññāsikhara
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 5:27 am
Contact:

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby Paññāsikhara » Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:15 am

When asking "Is gravity impermanent?", it may be worthwhile distinguishing between a couple of points, all of which may come under the broad idea of "gravity" in non-specialist terms, but which for the sake of this question, may lead to very different answers.

1. Gravitation - in the Newtonian sense. Newton's law of universal gravitation states that every object in this universe attracts every other object with a force which is directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of distance between their centres.
2. Gravitation - According to general relativity, the observed gravitational attraction between masses results from the warping of space and time by those masses.
3. The specific gravitational force exterted by planet earth upon objects, such as that which stops us flying into space.

Moreover, wrt to Buddhism, when Buddhism is making statements like "sabba-sankhara anicca", or "sabba-dhamma anatta", etc. all these sankhara and dhamma are referring to phenomena, and not to the laws relating phenomena. For instance, paticcasamuppada is not considered a dhamma in the sense of a phenomena (by most schools), even though it is considered a dhamma as an abstract principle. The principle itself is paticcasamuppada, whereas the objects subject to this principle are paticcasamuppanna. Quite different, and not to be confused.

So, whereas the specific force that, say, makes my body "fall downwards" is one thing, whereas the general principle that there is going to be an attractive force between my body and the earth, is another. The former will vary, with my own mass, the mass of the earth, and the distance between myself and the (center of) mass of the earth. However, the principle itself does not.
My recently moved Blog, containing some of my writings on the Buddha Dhamma, as well as a number of translations from classical Buddhist texts and modern authors, liturgy, etc.: .

nowheat
Posts: 529
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2009 3:42 am

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby nowheat » Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:15 pm


notself
Posts: 134
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:49 pm

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby notself » Sun Nov 01, 2009 3:45 pm

Though one may conquer a thousand times a thousand men in battle, yet he is indeed the noblest victor who conquers himself. ---Dhp 103

User avatar
Modus.Ponens
Posts: 2637
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:38 am
Location: Gallifrey

Re: Is gravity impermanent

Postby Modus.Ponens » Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:13 am

I think the question would be better expressed as: Are the (true) laws of physics permanent?

Personaly, I think they are.

This subjetc raises a philosophical question very hard to answer: do the laws of physics exist even if we didn't? are the laws of physics just concepts created by us or do they exist independently of us, as absolute laws? good luck answering these questions! :tongue:
He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)


Return to “Connections to Other Paths”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine