Why ?

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Why ?

Postby Joop » Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:46 am

Hallo

A post perhaps not everybody will like.
I'm Joop, a freethinker Theravadin from the Netherlands (sometime I say: a non-existing tradition)

Yesterday I had a discussion with a man who calls himself Namdrol, in another forum: E-Sangha.
A not very nice discussion, partly because he closed the topic and made the name of 'dhammawheel' in my post invisible.
It was about my question to the people who started this Dhammawheel forum:
Why this new forum ? Was the culture in E-Sangha that bad?

Perhaps it was and is and that makes me sad.
Because I prefer discussing within Theravada and within the broad buddhist way, with Theravadins and other Buddhists.

I'm not sure that is possible in this forum. I can be a bit sectarian to me.
And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.

So I'm not sure I will join this forum.

Metta

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Re: Why ?

Postby tiltbillings » Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:56 am

I'm not sure that is possible in this forum. I can be a bit sectarian to me.
And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.


There are a number of Mahayanists here, actively participating, and there are are those here who do not center their study and practice around Buddhaghosa as well as those that do. In other words, while the focus is on Theravada, it is not a rigid, dictionnaire focus. There is very deliberately an accommodation here for the broad range of what falls under the umbrella of Theravada and for those who, while not Theravadin, are interested in learning about it and discussing it in its various aspects. So, welcome and I hope that you find this a comfortable place to visit and for discussion.
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond.
SN I, 38.

Ar scáth a chéile a mhaireas na daoine.
People live in one another’s shelter.
"We eat cold eels and think distant thoughts." -- Jack Johnson
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Re: Why ?

Postby Cittasanto » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:01 am

Hi Joop
I can't really talk about E-Sangha as I have never been a member, but Buddhaghosa is not someone I look at as difinitive, or as Theravada.
remember he came a millennium after Buddha and they got on just fine before him so after is not going to be a problem either is it?
their are many views expressed here not all theravada and not all theravada views are incorporating Buddhaghosa!
If you are going to join hi and welcome if not nice to meet you!
This offering maybe right, or wrong, but it is one, the other, both, or neither!
With Metta
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Blog, - Some Suttas Translated, Ajahn Chah.
"Others will misconstrue reality due to their personal perspectives, doggedly holding onto and not easily discarding them; We shall not misconstrue reality due to our own personal perspectives, nor doggedly holding onto them, but will discard them easily. This effacement shall be done."
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Re: Why ?

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:03 am

Greetings Joop,
Joop wrote:And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.

It certainly is possible... try the General Theravada forum, where any Theravadin perspective from the Buddha to Buddhaghosa to Buddhadasa will be more than welcome.

And speaking of welcome.... Welcome! :hello:

Metta,
Retro. :)
If you have asked me of the origination of unease, then I shall explain it to you in accordance with my understanding:
Whatever various forms of unease there are in the world, They originate founded in encumbering accumulation. (Pārāyanavagga)


Exalted in mind, just open and clearly aware, the recluse trained in the ways of the sages:
One who is such, calmed and ever mindful, He has no sorrows! -- Udana IV, 7


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Re: Why ?

Postby Ben » Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:08 pm

Hi Joop

Welcome to Dhamma Wheel and I hope you choose to stick around and help make this a great environment for yourself and others to learn about and discuss the Dhamma. As Tilt has said, there are Mahayanist practitioners who are active members of Dhamma Wheel. All are welcome at Dhamma Wheel regardless whether they consider Buddhaghossa authoritative or not, or whether they consider themselves Theravadin or not.
Kind regards

Ben
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Re: Why ?

Postby Element » Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:25 pm

Joop wrote:And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.

So I'm not sure I will join this forum.

Metta

Joop

Hello Joop,

Buddhism without Buddhaghosa is possible here. We have a 'Modern' forum.

At least I am very happy to talk about Buddhism without Buddhaghosa.

I consider Buddhaghosa was not enlightened. That is my opinion.

The Buddha advised his teaching would last 500 years. As usual, the Buddha was correct.

However, we have the good fortune that last century, the Buddha's teaching experienced a "rebirth".

In my opinion, this rebirth is the only enlightened rebirth. :smile:

Kind regards,

Element
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Re: Why ?

Postby Dhammanando » Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:57 pm

Hello Joop,

Thanks for dropping in. :smile:

Joop wrote:I'm not sure that is possible in this forum. I can be a bit sectarian to me.
And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.


As the previous posters have noted, it is our intention that this board be somewhat of a broad church. I hope you'll decide to stay around.

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
    ...and this thought arose in the mind of the Blessed One:
    “Who lives without reverence lives miserably.”
    Uruvela Sutta, A.ii.20

    It were endless to dispute upon everything that is disputable.
    — William Penn Some Fruits of Solitude,
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Re: Why ?

Postby David N. Snyder » Sat Jan 24, 2009 4:46 am

Hi Joop,

I remember your good posts. Here we have four Modern Theravada sub-forums and I remember how you liked to post in the Modern Theravada, so your views and knowledge are certainly welcome here!

As for the DhammaWheel.com being censored out over there, here is some advice from the Buddha about the importance of spreading the Dhamma and not hiding or censoring it:

Wander forth, O bhikkhus, for the welfare of the multitude, for the happiness of the multitude, out of compassion for the world, for the good, welfare, and happiness of devas and humans. Let not two go the same way. Teach, O bhikkhus, the Dhamma that is good in the beginning, good in the middle, good in the end, with the right meaning and phrasing.” Samyutta Nikaya 4.453

These three things, O monks, shine openly, not in secrecy. What three? The disc of the moon, the disc of the sun, and the Dhamma and Discipline explained by the Tathagata.” Anguttara Nikaya 3.129
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Re: Why ?

Postby Jechbi » Sat Jan 24, 2009 5:55 am

Welcome. I hope you stick around.

Looks like your question has not been directly answered, and perhaps it is not appropriate to do so, but I'd like to offer my perspective.

I very much appreciate E-Sangha. I think Namdrol is, in his own unique way, helpful and informative. But personally I feel more comfortable in an environment where communication is more open, where people are allowed to make mistakes now and then, and where discussions are not routinely shut down like this for no apparent reason. Sadly, there is simply no way at E-Sangha for members to talk about E-Sangha openly. Constructive criticism is not allowed. Public feedback about the site is not welcome. That strikes me as bizarre and, frankly, at odds with my understanding of Dhamma.

E-Sangha, as a privately owned site, certainly may do as it pleases and create the environment it feels is best. It is not a matter of censorship, because E-Sangha is not the government, and there are alternatives. Of course the mods and admins there should be allowed to do as they please. Their members can decide whether it works for them or not. Personally, I think Dhammawheel.com simply provides a more open environment where real discussion and appropriate debate are far more welcome. I don't feel like I'm walking on eggshells over here. Plus, if I want to, I can openly criticize things here, and nobody's going to make me invisible.

That said, I'd like to express my gratitude to Namdrol and others who have made E-Sangha very much a valuable service. It might be the second-best site on the Web. ;)

Metta
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.
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Re: Why ?

Postby Aloka » Sat Jan 24, 2009 6:28 am

Hi Joop,

In my opinion you should definately stay here and enjoy this forum. I am a practitioner of Tibetan Buddhism and already I am learning new things through having joined this site. I haven't taken part in any discussions yet because I'm a little shy and so I'm content to read what others have to say for the moment. The mods here have been most welcoming and kind to me, and have even allowed me to mention my own group.

Kind wishes,

Dazzle
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Re: Why ?

Postby ShinMeiDokuJoh » Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:42 pm

Joop wrote:(...)
Because I prefer discussing within Theravada and within the broad buddhist way, with Theravadins and other Buddhists.

I'm not sure that is possible in this forum. I can be a bit sectarian to me.
And I'm not sure also Modern Theravada (that's for me: Buddhism without Buddhaghosa) is possible here.
(...)

Joop


Hi Joop,

a warm welcome here...just try out, each forum has its own character and ambience.

Hope you enjoy your stay here.

With best Wishes
ShinMeiDokuJoh


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