Kalama Sutta

A forum for members who wish to develop a deeper understanding of the Pali Canon and associated Commentaries, which for discussion purposes are both treated as authoritative.

Moderator: Mahavihara moderator

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Kalama Sutta

Postby Cittasanto » Fri Jan 02, 2009 7:14 pm

Hi All Here are a couple of links to the Kalama Sutta
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
http://www.engaged-zen.org/Liturgy/Kernel.html
the second one I mentioned in another thread!

I have heard that this sutta is about trusting our own judgements of what is true and false, Kamma, and the Four Divine Abidings, the last one I think is wrong and reading into the sutta too much! what do you all think about this sutta and how has it affected your practice, if at all!


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 17855
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Jan 02, 2009 11:13 pm

Greetings Manapa,

I like the Kalama Sutta but there's a lot of dodgy "generic Buddha quotes" floating around which misrepresent it and posit it to mean something it doesn't mean at all. For me the highlights are:

* Showing the connection between the Three Wholesome/Unwholesome Roots and resultant consequences... showing the wholesome to be skilful
* Basing the evaluation of any given Dhamma on the above, rather than conjecture or views
* The four assurances, showing that following the above will bring benefit regardless

What a wonderful sequence of logic for teachings those who are skeptical.

Another related article:

The Right to Ask Questions by Larry Rosenberg
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... toask.html

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

User avatar
Ben
Posts: 18442
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: kanamaluka

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Ben » Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:13 am

Hi Manapa and Retro

Bhikkhu Bodhi wrote an excellent essay on the Kalama Sutta:

A Look at the Kalama Sutta by Bhikkhu Bodhi: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... ay_09.html

Personally, I think its important to understand the context in which different suttas were uttered. I tend to agree with Bhikkhu Bodhi that the sutta was not meant to be interpreted as "the Buddha's Charter of Free Inquiry", and that the advice given to the Kalamas was specific to their situation.

Having said that, as a young thing many moons ago while escaping the grasp of Catholicism, the words of the Kalama Sutta had a powerful effect on me.
Kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

User avatar
stuka
Posts: 171
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:37 am

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby stuka » Sat Jan 03, 2009 7:47 am


User avatar
kc2dpt
Posts: 957
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby kc2dpt » Sun Jan 04, 2009 2:11 am

- Peter


User avatar
Ben
Posts: 18442
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:49 am
Location: kanamaluka

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Ben » Sun Jan 04, 2009 2:24 am

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

User avatar
appicchato
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby appicchato » Sun Jan 04, 2009 3:14 am

Question time...in the Kalama Sutta the Buddha advised the Kalamas 'not to rely on....collections of texts'...to me this seems to imply the written word...if so, why weren't the Buddha's words 'laid' down at the time?...

User avatar
kc2dpt
Posts: 957
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby kc2dpt » Sun Jan 04, 2009 4:38 am

- Peter


User avatar
Jason
Posts: 474
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2009 1:09 am
Location: Earth
Contact:

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Jason » Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:01 am

Manapa,

As Thanissaro Bhikkhu points out in his note to , the Kalama Sutta not only suggests that any view or belief should be tested by the results it yields when put into practice, but — to guard against the possibility of any bias or limitations in one's understanding of those results — they must further be checked against the experience of people who are wise. Personally, I think that this is fabulous advice, and regardless if it was meant for those who have yet to take refuge in the Dhamma, that is how I approach the practice myself. Although, to be honest, finding people who are (or at least seem to be) wise can be rather difficult.

Jason
"Sabbe dhamma nalam abhinivesaya" ().

(Buddhist-related blog)
(non-Buddhist related blog)

User avatar
Will
Posts: 709
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:26 pm

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Will » Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:29 am

A bodhisattva does not become weary of evil beings nor does he commit the error of bringing forth thoughts inclined to reject them and cast them aside. Avatamsaka Sutra, ch. 25

User avatar
appicchato
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby appicchato » Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:07 am


User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 3521
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Huai Bong, Lamphun

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Dhammanando » Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:07 am


User avatar
stuka
Posts: 171
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:37 am

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby stuka » Tue Jan 06, 2009 6:14 pm


User avatar
kc2dpt
Posts: 957
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:48 pm

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby kc2dpt » Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:10 pm

- Peter


User avatar
stuka
Posts: 171
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:37 am

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby stuka » Tue Jan 06, 2009 9:10 pm


User avatar
stuka
Posts: 171
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:37 am

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby stuka » Wed Jan 07, 2009 11:25 am

My apologies, I don't know if it is an anomaly inherent to this monitor, but from here, there seems to be no difference between regular and bolded text. Please advise.

User avatar
Dhammanando
Posts: 3521
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:44 pm
Location: Huai Bong, Lamphun

Re: Kalama Sutta

Postby Dhammanando » Wed Jan 07, 2009 4:34 pm



Return to “Classical Theravāda”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AvaLily and 4 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine