Bhikkuni's / Ajahn Brahm /Thai lineage?

[BlackBird]

While we're on the topic of preceptors and lineages, let's not forget where this 'Theravadin' lineage of Bhikkhunis has arisen from.

metta
Jack

[Cittasanto]

Hi Jack,
I thought the Sri Lankan line werent from there? I though it was reinstated by a single ordination done by monks in sri lanka?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordination ... #Sri_Lanka" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.dhammalight.com/corresponden ... aloka.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (about half way down)

[Cittasanto]

realised it was posted on the wrong thread sorry please delete this post

[BlackBird]

Hi Manapa

I don't really know what to think about ordination of Bhikkhuni's where actual Bhikkhuni's do not serve as preceptors. Safe to say I don't know enough about this to form an opinion.

Also on a side note JC only the Siam Nikaya actually comes from Thailand. Interestingly it is the same chapter of Sri Lankan Buddhism that only admits members from the highest social caste. They're pretty much the ones in charge too it seems, and control many of the historic and important sites. The Amarapura Nikaya comes from Burma, so to the Rammana Nikaya. It is in the latter two that you'll actually find most of the real practitioners, particularly the Rammana Nikaya, which contains the Galduwa Forest tradition.

[tellyontellyon]

Still not sure... does a Bhikkuni wanting to be part of the Therevada tradition need a Therevadin preceptor... or is a Bhukkuni, is a Bhukkuni, is a Bhukkuni?

Is the necessity for the preceptor to be a Therevadin Bhukkuni, or would a Bhukkuni from another tradition qualify?
Does the vinaya specify that the Bhukkuni must be from the same tradition?

Do Therevadins not recognise Bukkhunis from other traditions as Bhikkunis?

Sorry to ask so many questions.

[Cittasanto]

Still not sure... does a Bhikkuni wanting to be part of the Therevada tradition need a Therevadin preceptor... or is a Bhukkuni, is a Bhukkuni, is a Bhukkuni?

Is the necessity for the preceptor to be a Therevadin Bhukkuni, or would a Bhukkuni from another tradition qualify?
Does the vinaya specify that the Bhukkuni must be from the same tradition?

Do Therevadins not recognise Bukkhunis from other traditions as Bhikkunis?

Sorry to ask so many questions.

A bhikkhuni is a bhikkhuni etc, but the different vinaya lines are not all the same in the amount of rules they follow so this would or could cause problems in sanghakamma (that is to my knowledge anyway quite happy to be proven wrong).

[jcsuperstar]

here, from the wiki, maybe it helps
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinaya

Vinayas arose in Buddhism, based upon geographical or cultural differences and the different Buddhist schools that developed. Three of these are still in use. The Vinayas are the same in substance and have only minor differences. Buddhists in Burma, Cambodia, Laos, Sri Lanka, and Thailand follow the Theravadin Vinaya, which has 227 rules for the bhikkhus (male monastics) and 311 for the bhikkhunis (female monastics, though the female order died out centuries ago and recent attempts to restore it from the Chinese tradition are controversial). Buddhists in China, Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Vietnam follow the Dharmaguptaka Vinaya (四分律), which has 250 rules[5] for the bhikkhus and 348 rules[6] for the bhikkhunis. Buddhists in Tibet and Mongolia follow the Mūlasarvāstivāda Vinaya

so you see when we talk about being a theravada monk, in this situation, it is refering to the theravada vinaya, not really any specific philosophical ideology.
how monks, nuns, priests from other traditions are accepted by theravada is on a case by case basis depending on the monk youre talking to. some temples/monks may be more liberal than others. there is no ruling body, or pope of theravada to decide such things.

[BudSas]

here, from the wiki, maybe it helps
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinaya

Vinayas arose in Buddhism, based upon geographical or cultural differences and the different Buddhist schools that developed. Three of these are still in use. The Vinayas are the same in substance and have only minor differences. Buddhists in Burma, Cambodia, Laos, Sri Lanka, and Thailand follow the Theravadin Vinaya, which has 227 rules for the bhikkhus (male monastics) and 311 for the bhikkhunis (female monastics, though the female order died out centuries ago and recent attempts to restore it from the Chinese tradition are controversial). Buddhists in China, Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Vietnam follow the Dharmaguptaka Vinaya (四分律), which has 250 rules[5] for the bhikkhus and 348 rules[6] for the bhikkhunis. Buddhists in Tibet and Mongolia follow the Mūlasarvāstivāda Vinaya

Generally, the main difference between the Dharmaguptaka Vinaya and the Theravada Vinaya is in the Sekhiya part (rules for training): The DV contains more rules than the TV.

BDS