All very nice, but a bit of a dodge, it seems. No one is anywhere close to asking you to drop everything to answer the question reasonably put to you. Very simply one could say: "I am very busy at this moment, but in a day or two when I have enough free time, I'll be more than happy to respond in detail." Very simply.pink_trike wrote: I have two turkeys in ovens . . . .
Why did you choose Theravada?
- tiltbillings
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Here's something:tiltbillings wrote:Back up your claim.pin-trike wrote:Increasingly, scholars are unable to find any solid evidence of it...evidence that should be available if he actually lived and wasn't just a conceptual devise.
Lopez (1995). Buddhism in Practice. Princeton University Press. pp. 16
Not my claim and I haven't read the Lotus Sutra but the above seems common sense to me. To understand a text it helps to understand the context.tiltbillings wrote:Back up your claim.pink_trike wrote:
I was just pointing out that without a very thorough understanding of how the Sutra was constructed, the specific use of metaphor and allegory, and more importantly, the cultural milieu within which it was constructed, it would be impossible to even consider the possibility of the grand conclusions you put forth.
_/|\_
_/|\_
- pink_trike
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Thank you for educating me on how I should respond when I'm busy. I didn't realize that "I'm too busy right now" was inadequate. Perhaps you might consider that barking "back up your claim." might be stated a bit differently. Maybe something along the lines of "That's very interesting. Could you provide some more details when you have time?".tiltbillings wrote:All very nice, but a bit of a dodge, it seems. No one is anywhere close to asking you to drop everything to answer the question reasonably put to you. Very simply one could say: "I am very busy at this moment, but in a day or two when I have enough free time, I'll be more than happy to respond in detail." Very simply.pink_trike wrote: I have two turkeys in ovens . . . .
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
- pink_trike
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
LOL...you're persistently consistent.tiltbillings wrote:All very nice, but a bit of a dodge, it seems.pink_trike wrote: I have two turkeys in ovens . . . .
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Did a bit of a search round the internet, couldn't find much that wasn't marred with opinion, nothing factual in any case.
Buddha-denial
...and you thought rebirth-denial was bad...
Buddha-denial
...and you thought rebirth-denial was bad...
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Right pink_trike, you too.pink_trike wrote:I have two turkeys in ovens, and am making a couple of pies. Shortly a whole bunch of friends and family who also don't care if there was a living buddha or not are going to start ringing the doorbell. Sorry if that's inconvenient for you...I understand you're in a big hurry, but that's hardly justification for calling my so-called claim "cheap" and saying I'm "unwilling". Get a grip...I have a life and that one line "claim" doesn't justify your reactive froth or the urgency you're bringing to this imaginary issue. Isn't right about now when you slam the topic shut?tiltbillings wrote:It is cheap talk to make such claims and then being "unwilling" - unable - to back them up. You are correct, your claims are baseless.pink_trike wrote:]
What part of "I'm too busy" and "I'm not interested" don't you understand?
Yes, yes...I know, saying this just proves that my claim is baseless.
Have a great holiday!
As for this disagreement, isn't it silly? I mean, why should Buddhists get a little uptight with such an offhanded statement?
After all, its not like the entire foundation of Buddhism rests on Gotama's actual, real and tangible enlightenment experience, right?
And why wouldn't a religious person just accept your statement and not call bullocks? Why would they hound you
for a reference? Can't they see that you're too busy, what with your many posts to the forum saying that you are, or
saying that you don't care if the Buddha existed. Can't they just not care too? Such people, they're a little beneath you.
Well, have a good holiday.
- tiltbillings
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Obviously too busy for giving the situation considered thought, but always happy to help.pink_trike wrote:Thank you for educating me on how I should respond when I'm busy.tiltbillings wrote:All very nice, but a bit of a dodge, it seems. No one is anywhere close to asking you to drop everything to answer the question reasonably put to you. Very simply one could say: "I am very busy at this moment, but in a day or two when I have enough free time, I'll be more than happy to respond in detail." Very simply.pink_trike wrote: I have two turkeys in ovens . . . .
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
I think it has a lot to do with projection TheReductor.
In these situations it's very easy to project what emotions you think the other party is feeling. In a disagreement over the internet it may be that both people initially project that the other person must be angry, when in fact neither are, and thus it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Tilt certainly doesn't mash his words, neither does PT, which is perhaps why this whole situation might seem a little angsty, but that may not be the case.
I've got an idea, let's ask these two gentlemen how they feel:
Tilt, are you angry?
Pink Trike, are you angry?
Are either of you harboring resentment?
metta
Jack
In these situations it's very easy to project what emotions you think the other party is feeling. In a disagreement over the internet it may be that both people initially project that the other person must be angry, when in fact neither are, and thus it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Tilt certainly doesn't mash his words, neither does PT, which is perhaps why this whole situation might seem a little angsty, but that may not be the case.
I've got an idea, let's ask these two gentlemen how they feel:
Tilt, are you angry?
Pink Trike, are you angry?
Are either of you harboring resentment?
metta
Jack
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
- tiltbillings
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- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Given how busy you are with all those turkeys and what you do seem to have a surprising amount of time for the snideness.pink_trike wrote:LOL...you're persistently consistent.tiltbillings wrote:All very nice, but a bit of a dodge, it seems.pink_trike wrote: I have two turkeys in ovens . . . .
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
- pink_trike
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
More than a littleAs for this disagreement, isn't it silly?
Fear? Insecurity? intolerance?...why should Buddhists get a little uptight with such an offhanded statement?
That's debatable, but the foundations of the Dharma surely don't depend on it. [the term "enlightenment" is a poorly understood translation that's created much confusion and delusion]....its not like the entire foundation of Buddhism rests on Gotama's actual, real and tangible enlightenment experience, right?
My statement that secular scholars are having trouble finding a Buddha that actually lived? Since that debate really does exist and it has for a long time, what's to call bullocks on?And why wouldn't a religious person just accept your statement and not call bullocks?
I should drop everything and start looking through books. Saying "I'm busy" 3 times isn't acceptable to religious people? My, my...Can't they see that you're too busy
Now that you mention it, it does seem like they're a bit touchy around certain subjects that maybe rub up against their comfort zone. I stated a fact (yes, there is a debate). I offered no opinion regarding that debate. Why all the reactivity and urgency?Can't they just not care too?
Anyway, gotta go or I'll burn the pies. When I have time and it seems interesting enough I'll dig out some info. Please, don't anyone hold their breath. I'm into retreat starting monday and won't be back until the 4th.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
- tiltbillings
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- Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 9:25 am
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Reread his msg. Might it not be an expression of irony?BlackBird wrote:I think it has a lot to do with projection TheReductor.
No. Simply asking a question. it is all too easy to make statements without putting one's money where the mouth has flapped, which doers not make for dialogue.Tilt, are you angry?
Not today.Are either of you harboring resentment?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.
“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
I think some might argue that it does.thereductor wrote: After all, its not like the entire foundation of Buddhism rests on Gotama's actual, real and tangible enlightenment experience, right?
Edit: Apparently I missed the irony too by not reading closely enough, apologies. But I do think it's worth noting that this is not the first time I've heard it suggested that "it doesn't matter if the Buddha was real or not". It most certainly does.
Last edited by Tex on Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
"To reach beyond fear and danger we must sharpen and widen our vision. We have to pierce through the deceptions that lull us into a comfortable complacency, to take a straight look down into the depths of our existence, without turning away uneasily or running after distractions." -- Bhikkhu Bodhi
"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man." -- Heraclitus
"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man." -- Heraclitus
- pink_trike
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Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Dinner is at 9:30 pm. It's 8:50 pm. I've have somewhere around 5000 books in no particular order. Tilt, I'm so very sorry I can't cancel everything, sort through my books and papers, and attend to your demand.tiltbillings wrote:Given how busy you are with all those turkeys and what you do seem to have a surprising amount of time for the snideness.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Well, now that you mention it.tiltbillings wrote:Reread his msg. Might it not be an expression of irony?
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta
Path Press - Ñāṇavīra Thera Dhamma Page - Ajahn Nyanamoli's Dhamma talks
- pink_trike
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- Contact:
Re: Why did you choose Theravada?
Not in the slightest.BlackBird wrote: Pink Trike, are you angry?
M'gawd...non-issue.
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss
- Dawa Gyaltsen
---
Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.