YOU CANNOT POST. OUR WEB HOSTING COMPANY DECIDED TO MOVE THE SERVER TO ANOTHER LOCATION. IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN VIEW THIS VERSION WHICH DOES NOT ALLOW POSTING AND WILL NOT SAVE ANYTHING YOU DO ONCE THE OTHER SERVER GOES ONLINE.

Temporary Ordination - Dhamma Wheel

Temporary Ordination

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.
User avatar
theravada_guy
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 2:06 am

Temporary Ordination

Postby theravada_guy » Mon Jan 25, 2010 8:59 pm

Greetings all,

Did the Buddha sanction temporary ordination? If He did not, what purpose does it serve?
With metta,

Justin

User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby jcsuperstar » Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:39 pm

it's a cultural thing
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

User avatar
theravada_guy
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 2:06 am

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby theravada_guy » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:09 pm

jcsuperstar,

That's what I kinda figured. Thanks. :anjali:
With metta,

Justin

User avatar
Bhikkhu Pesala
Posts: 3670
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:17 pm

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:11 pm

All conditioned things are temporary. :juggling:
• • • • (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Cittasanto » Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:43 pm

he didn't prohibit it either! nor would it be a new thing, or completely cultural. there is an origin story to the rule about the maximum number of times someone can ordain where the man ordained 6 times, and disrobed then ordained again on the seventh they initially refused until they went to the Buddha to see what to do, and he set the rule of no more than seven ordinations, the common practice will be cultural, but not the taking of ordination for a temporary period of time whether planned, or not.


He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

User avatar
theravada_guy
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 2:06 am

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby theravada_guy » Tue Jan 26, 2010 12:19 am

Manapa,

Thanks! Despite my own thought that it was a cultural thing, you answered my question and corrected me. :anjali:
With metta,

Justin

User avatar
appicchato
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby appicchato » Tue Jan 26, 2010 1:20 am


User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Cittasanto » Tue Jan 26, 2010 2:30 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

User avatar
appicchato
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby appicchato » Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:02 am

Context, semantics, and probably a few other things thrown in as well...the gist of the OP's idea was (I think) that of ordaining for only a specific amount of time, calculated before ordaining...just offering one person's alternative view...it's all good... :smile:

User avatar
Cittasanto
Posts: 6524
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:31 pm
Location: Ellan Vannin
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Cittasanto » Tue Jan 26, 2010 3:46 am



He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.

User avatar
Bhikkhu Pesala
Posts: 3670
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:17 pm

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Tue Jan 26, 2010 12:07 pm

• • • • (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)

suanck
Posts: 93
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 7:51 am

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby suanck » Tue Jan 26, 2010 1:12 pm

I understand that Temporary Ordination is popular in Burma, Thailand, Laos, and Cambodia, but this practice is not popular in Sri Lanka. Is it correct ?

Suan

MJH
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:54 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby MJH » Wed Jan 27, 2010 10:09 pm


User avatar
appicchato
Posts: 1603
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:47 am
Location: Bridge on the River Kwae

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby appicchato » Wed Jan 27, 2010 10:55 pm


meindzai
Posts: 595
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:10 pm

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby meindzai » Wed Jan 27, 2010 11:02 pm


User avatar
jcsuperstar
Posts: 1915
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:15 am
Location: alaska
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby jcsuperstar » Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:06 am

i had planed, for years, to ordain for life, worked on saving up to pay off all my debts had a pretty meager existence for quite sometime, then as i was living in a temple here on the verge of leaving i met a thai girl who started helping me with my thai and well now we're married so unless she dies or dies first i have no plans to ordain for life, however i will ordain temporarily (maybe 3 months to a year) since 1. i want to, and 2. shes thai and her parents have no sons so i would be making merit for her family and be becoming more a part of thai culture. i'm looking forward to it, i think it will do wonders for my practice, my attitude, my patience etc, i've had nothing but great experiences with my extended stays in temples and i'm quite sure this longer stay will be of great benefit not only to me but my married life as well.
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

User avatar
LauraJ
Posts: 151
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 8:38 pm

Temporary Ordination

Postby LauraJ » Thu Jan 28, 2010 3:46 am

I know there must be a simple answer to this :)
Who do people take temporary ordination? Does it benefit one's later lay practice? Is it done for reasons of virtue?

Thanks!
Laura



Conquer the angry man by love. Conquer the ill-natured man by goodness. Conquer the miser with generosity. Conquer the liar with truth. -The Dhammapada

User avatar
David N. Snyder
Site Admin
Posts: 10648
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 4:15 am
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby David N. Snyder » Thu Jan 28, 2010 4:05 am

I think it could be like an extended retreat. While on retreat it is sort of like being monastic, temporarily.

jcsuperstar has a great answer here:

viewtopic.php?f=30&t=3359&p=49476#p49476
Image




Paññāsikhara
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 5:27 am
Contact:

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Paññāsikhara » Thu Jan 28, 2010 5:01 am

My recently moved Blog, containing some of my writings on the Buddha Dhamma, as well as a number of translations from classical Buddhist texts and modern authors, liturgy, etc.: .

User avatar
Goofaholix
Posts: 2928
Joined: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:49 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Temporary Ordination

Postby Goofaholix » Thu Jan 28, 2010 7:39 am

Temporary ordination is when one ordains with the intention of it being for a specific period of time or at least with the idea that this is something you're going to do before going on to something else.

Of course everything is impermanent and sometimes things don't work out for someone who intended to go forth for life, but to me that's different, the intention wasn't that it be temporary.

I, and I think most westerners, struggle to believe that temporary ordination is anything close to the ideal of going forth from home to homelessness, and in a world where retreat centres are readily available I don't really see the point other than cultural.

Despite this I did ordain for 3 months before getting married for much the same reasons as outlined by jcsuperstar as my wife is thai and it seemed like the best way for me to get a good long retreat before getting married.

I was lucky to get into a very good forest wat and it was a really good experience but even so I think I probably would have gained more from doing something like the 3 month retreat at IMS.

I do think temporary ordination cheapens the ideal of monkhood and it would be better if people did retreats instead like we do in the West unless they want to make a long commitment, but it was a matter of fitting in with the culture I was marrying into and making a compromise that benefited everyone.


Return to “Ordination and Monastic Life”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests

Google Saffron, Theravada Search Engine