multiple simultaneous samadhis

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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby appicchato » Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:39 am

Freawaru wrote:...if I can find someone who can give those definitions based on experience ...


http://www.abhidhamma.org/forums/

Perhaps there's someone there that can shed some light on your queries...
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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby pt1 » Wed Feb 24, 2010 4:10 am

Freawaru wrote:But why does Visuddhimagga 12 then not only teach fourth form realm jhana? Why all this playing with entering and leaving kasinas and all eight jhanas?

Hm, not sure. Maybe it has to do with safety? I mean, I think the sequence was - one first gains jhana mastery (entering, exiting and changing jhanas at will, etc) and only then starts with iddhis. E.g. imagine a scenario where electricity is suddenly off in your town and so you decide to use your iddhis to cook dinner (something I think I read that Dipa Ma taught her daughters how to do). And so, you start the rapid switching between fourth jhana and access concentration with element of fire in order to produce heat for cooking. And somewhere there, in the middle of the switching, you accidentally forget to use a kasina for the fourth jhana, and you accidentally end up in jhana of infinite space without knowing how to exit quickly. And as a result, the heat you were generating to heat up a small pot of soup suddenly expands and burns you entire kitchen, or more... :stirthepot:

I don't really know obviously... :toilet:

Anyway, I checked a bit online regarding where you could ask your questions:

This is a US website of two Pa Auk Sayadaw's pupils - as far as I can see from this page:
http://www.jhanasadvice.com/id4.html
they won't mind answering questions for free, or paid if you want to ask a lot. Not sure if they know iddhis, but they should know a lot about visuddhimagga type jhanas.

This is a yahoo group that seems to be focused on teachings of Pa Auk Sayadaw and his pupil Sayalay Dipankara who's based in Singapore:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Pa-Auk/
Though can't tell if the group is open to all or only from Malaysia...

Anyway, might be worth checking these out. There must be more stuff online for people interested in visuddhimagga type jhanas, iddhis, etc. Maybe someone else can point to more sources.

Best wishes
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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby Freawaru » Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:11 am

appicchato wrote:
Freawaru wrote:...if I can find someone who can give those definitions based on experience ...


http://www.abhidhamma.org/forums/

Perhaps there's someone there that can shed some light on your queries...


Dear Bhante,

thank you for the link :D
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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby Freawaru » Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:41 am

pt1 wrote:
Freawaru wrote:But why does Visuddhimagga 12 then not only teach fourth form realm jhana? Why all this playing with entering and leaving kasinas and all eight jhanas?

Hm, not sure. Maybe it has to do with safety? I mean, I think the sequence was - one first gains jhana mastery (entering, exiting and changing jhanas at will, etc) and only then starts with iddhis. E.g. imagine a scenario where electricity is suddenly off in your town and so you decide to use your iddhis to cook dinner (something I think I read that Dipa Ma taught her daughters how to do). And so, you start the rapid switching between fourth jhana and access concentration with element of fire in order to produce heat for cooking. And somewhere there, in the middle of the switching, you accidentally forget to use a kasina for the fourth jhana, and you accidentally end up in jhana of infinite space without knowing how to exit quickly. And as a result, the heat you were generating to heat up a small pot of soup suddenly expands and burns you entire kitchen, or more... :stirthepot:


Ah, okay, I am convinced :jumping:

Seriously. I think some kind of Hogwarts would be useful. I wouldn't want pyrokinesis getting out of control. Luckily, I never have been experiencing this particular one (as far as I recall). But I remember the time I would jump into states I didn't even fully recall afterwards (all of them blissful but that is not much of a description) even when driving the car. At first it freaked me out, I feared there might be accidents when "I" wasn't around to drive the car. Fortunately, this never was the case, the character must have been driving without "me".

Anyway, I checked a bit online regarding where you could ask your questions:

This is a US website of two Pa Auk Sayadaw's pupils - as far as I can see from this page:
http://www.jhanasadvice.com/id4.html
they won't mind answering questions for free, or paid if you want to ask a lot. Not sure if they know iddhis, but they should know a lot about visuddhimagga type jhanas.

This is a yahoo group that seems to be focused on teachings of Pa Auk Sayadaw and his pupil Sayalay Dipankara who's based in Singapore:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Pa-Auk/
Though can't tell if the group is open to all or only from Malaysia...

Anyway, might be worth checking these out. There must be more stuff online for people interested in visuddhimagga type jhanas, iddhis, etc. Maybe someone else can point to more sources.

Best wishes


Thank you for the links and all your help :smile:
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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby Dmytro » Wed Feb 24, 2010 9:12 pm

Hi Freawaru,

IMHO the best result of all the jhana mastery is that it helps to enter the emptiness (sunnata), the themeless (animitta). One gets enough of all these bases of concentration and can do without them :^)

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .wlsh.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

Metta, Dmytro
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Re: multiple simultaneous samadhis

Postby Freawaru » Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:24 am

Hi Dmytro,

Dmytro wrote:Hi Freawaru,

IMHO the best result of all the jhana mastery is that it helps to enter the emptiness (sunnata), the themeless (animitta). One gets enough of all these bases of concentration and can do without them :^)

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .wlsh.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html

Metta, Dmytro


Thank you. :smile:

Isn't it remarkable that emptiness is always connected with the heart?

Do you know why there are these repetitions? As if there are two discerning faculties addressed? Or maybe a kind of echo???

'One of poor discernment, one of poor discernment': Thus is it said. To what extent is one said to be 'one of poor discernment'?"
"'One doesn't discern, one doesn't discern': Thus, friend, one is said to be 'one of poor discernment.'
...
asked him a further question: "Discerning, discerning': Thus is it said. To what extent, friend, is one said to be 'discerning'?"

"'One discerns, one discerns': Thus, friend, one is said to be 'discerning.'
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
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