Are Western Buddhists Perfectionistic Overachievers?

[Aloka]

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This is a rather puzzling question. Since I have no way of knowing the true aspirations or intentions of either 'the average eastern buddhist' or of all the other Buddhists in the west, I can't answer it.


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[christopher:::]

My inner perfectionist wishes i'd never started this discussion...

[Aloka]

My inner perfectionist wishes i'd never started this discussion...

Who ?

[m0rl0ck]

Really? Buddhism is much more then holidays. Many Westerners seem to take their dhamma practice very seriously, like the Whos in Whoville...

You misread my comment.

[Nibbida]

It may be safe to say that Westerners in general tend to be perfectionistic overachievers. It seems to be a consequence of our cultural ideals, the More, More, Better, Better philosophy that seems to underlie Western goals. So obviously that doesn't apply to all Western Buddhists, but it's my impression that it exists more among them compared to traditional Eastern Buddhists. It's inevitable that we will carry over ideas like the Protestant Work Ethic into our practice. Even if we aren't Protestants, it's an attitude that pervades our culture.

This is what Thanissaro Bhikkhu had to say along these lines: "Several years ago, when Ajaan Suwat was teaching a retreat at IMS, I was his interpreter. After the second or third day of the retreat he turned to me and said, "I notice that when these people meditate they're awfully grim." You'd look out across the room and all the people were sitting there very seriously, their faces tense, their eyes closed tight. It was almost as if they had Nirvana or Bust written across their foreheads."

From: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... tions.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[christopher:::]

You misread my comment.

Sorry about that.

The thing is i dont think we have the buddhist equivalent of the easter and xmas christian here in the west, the way they might in the east.

Yes, true!

This is what Thanissaro Bhikkhu had to say along these lines: "Several years ago, when Ajaan Suwat was teaching a retreat at IMS, I was his interpreter. After the second or third day of the retreat he turned to me and said, "I notice that when these people meditate they're awfully grim." You'd look out across the room and all the people were sitting there very seriously, their faces tense, their eyes closed tight. It was almost as if they had Nirvana or Bust written across their foreheads."

Yeah, this is kinda what i was referring to... but it's actually a "good" thing in many ways, and Asian culture is not so different, actually. It's just that what i've observed is there tends to be much more of a priority placed on education and career then on spiritual freedom and liberation.

When ego and social comparisons dominate this perfectionism and drive for achievement can have negative consequences- many people here in Japan judge themselves and one another by education level, test scores, who's school is best, which company is best, etc.

I've just watched this first hand in our home, with my wife (who is Japanese) and our eldest son who had to take high school entrance exams a few months ago. It's been hell, for her, for him...

[Nibbida]

Yeah, I'd say the Japanese are an exception to that generality. From what I understand they take the idea of perfectionism and run with it.

[Mukunda]

I think that, as a general rule, new converts to any religion tend to take it "more seriously", and focus on it more than those born to the tradition, and most "Western Buddhists" are converts. Whether that makes them perfectionists or overachievers, I don't know.

[christopher:::]

Good points.

[PeterB]

So have you drawn any conclusions from your poll Chris, or are you still wading through the seven votes ?

[m0rl0ck]

So have you drawn any conclusions from your poll Chris, or are you still wading through the seven votes ?

Personally, im finding the fact that the poll got seven votes out of over a thousand members, statistically significant

[christopher:::]

All i learned so far is that i have a perfectionistic aspect to my persona that would very much like to delete this poorly worded poll (and topic) and put it in the trash...

So, guess its been useful in that sense.

[retrofuturist]

Greetings Chris:::,

I don't know about the delete, but I can go you the next best thing and close it.



Metta,
Retro.