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Disrespect - Dhamma Wheel

Disrespect

A forum for beginners and members of other Buddhist traditions to ask questions about Theravāda (The Way of the Elders). Responses require moderator approval before they are visible.
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Hunter
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Disrespect

Postby Hunter » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:25 pm

I see that in Theravada counries that many people talk about disrespect of the images of Buddha and that some people, like the music artist Akon, are banned from such countries for disrespect. I have also heard of other things too regarding disrespect in theravada countires. So what im wondering is, what constitutes disrespect towards an image of Buddha and what would the consequences be?
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Disrespect

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:44 pm

pointing your feet at the buddha, being naked in front of the buddha things like that. mostly people will just think youre an [email protected]#hole, uncultured, rude etc
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Hunter
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Hunter » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:49 pm

But are there any Karmic Consequences? Did Buddha ever talk about this subject or is it not really of importance. The way I look at it is that the image of a Buddha represents his qualities and his teachings and should therefore be respected. I know that there are many people out there who have images of Buddha adorning their house and use the statues for decoration. Im sure the same people have also pointed their feet at the statue, and been naked around the statue sense they see it as decoration. What would happen to them? Would they have severe consequences or do they have to intend to be disrespectful?
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Disrespect

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:57 pm

weeeelllll there were no Buddha images at the time of the Buddha so he never taught about them. i think we have a thread going on right now about this also maybe you can look into that one see what others think. basically though your mental state determines everything so it is with mind that you make wholesome or unwholesome kamma.
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Monkey Mind
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Monkey Mind » Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:10 pm

Okay, I couldn't immediately find the other thread you mentioned, so I will ask my question here. I was gifted a coffee mug with an image of Buddha (face of a statue), and a quote from the Dhammapada. It is a very pretty mug. I received some feedback from Tibetan practitioners that the mug might be offensive to some traditions. What about the Theravada crowd? Will people think I am "an [email protected]#hole, uncultured, rude etc"? Or is it not a big deal from the Theravadan POV?
"As I am, so are others;
as others are, so am I."
Having thus identified self and others,
harm no one nor have them harmed.

Sutta Nipāta 3.710

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Disrespect

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:37 pm

theravada isnt one big crowd, it would depend on if youre spending time with certain ethic buddhists, many american buddhists wouldnt care though. i wouldnt
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Modus.Ponens » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:08 pm

I don't see how a mug with the image of the Buddha would be disrespectful.

The Buddha talked about this. in the Vinaya it is said that he didn't want anyone to build images of him.
He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

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Hunter
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Hunter » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:49 pm

Modus could you post the vinaya where Buddha talks about having no images of him. I have heard of this but I could never find it. Thanks!
the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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tiltbillings
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Re: Disrespect

Postby tiltbillings » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:50 pm


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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Modus.Ponens » Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:19 pm

He turns his mind away from those phenomena, and having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.'
(Jhana Sutta - Thanissaro Bhikkhu translation)

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tiltbillings
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Re: Disrespect

Postby tiltbillings » Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:09 pm


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mikenz66
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Re: Disrespect

Postby mikenz66 » Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:50 pm


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kc2dpt
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Re: Disrespect

Postby kc2dpt » Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:00 pm

- Peter


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mikenz66
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Re: Disrespect

Postby mikenz66 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 12:28 am


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withoutcolour
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Re: Disrespect

Postby withoutcolour » Wed Jun 23, 2010 1:00 am

Gee I hope being naked in front of a Buddha statue isn't bad because my five Buddha statues watch me get dressed every day!!! :popcorn:

Anyway. The Buddha image isn't really the Buddha, don't be too attached to the image.
Obviously be respectful.
As mentioned before, in certain countries you shouldn't point your feet at the Buddha or take photos with it.
And again, Buddha never wanted statues erected of him, or to be worshiped really. The point of a Buddha statue, at least the way I was taught, is to remind us to be mindful, compassionate, and of the Buddha's teachings. Also, I was taught that bowing at statues of the Buddha is representation of bowing at one's own potential to be a Buddha, one's own compassion and wisdom, and one's potential attainments.

Bottom line is, in public just follow the local customs as to what's respectful.

-wc
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ
sabbe sattā sukhita hontu

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Hunter
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Hunter » Wed Jun 23, 2010 1:05 am

the Buddha said :

"Intention, monks, is karma, I say. Having willed, one acts through body, speech and mind."

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Disrespect

Postby Bhikkhu Pesala » Wed Jun 23, 2010 4:24 am

• • • • (Upasampadā: 24th June, 1979)

rowyourboat
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Re: Disrespect

Postby rowyourboat » Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:55 pm

Once a sri lankan meditating bikkhu said 'ganda keliye budunta mal puja kalath, vesi keliye mala paha kalath ekai'. Roughly translated to 'whether you offer flowers to the buddha or offer faeces to a toilet it is the same'. He was trying to shock his sri lankan disciples from their attachment to the buddha and trying to get them to see that everything is sankhara which were anicca dukkha and anatta. Some people found this quite difficult to swallow, others with vipassana insight could understand where he was coming from.
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

PeterB
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Re: Disrespect

Postby PeterB » Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:18 pm

I think that kind of response ( that of the Bhikkhu ) has to be contextualised rowyourboat.
In a context of those who may have been raised with an exaggerated and perhaps superstitious fear of certain kinds of imagery it might be a good corrective.
But the westerners have been raised with a widely internalised distrust of authority and with an iconoclastic view of the sacred.
This can lead westerners to many years of resistance to instruction, and of attempting a D.I.Y approach to Dhamma in a fruitless attempt to reinforce an independence that they in reality do not have . That in fact does not exist.

We should show respect to Buddha Rupas , not because we will go to hell if we don't, but because if we don't, at a deep level we are disrespecting ourselves and our best aspirations.
Incidentally, I don't think that getting dressed in front of a Buddha Rupa shows disrespect.

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Re: Disrespect

Postby mythree » Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:49 pm

i think it's people's attitude towards buddha.am from Sri Lanka couple of months ago SL government banned Akon concert here in colombo because of his video women dancing in swimming dress in front of buddha statue( Sexy Chik video). because the way we asians think of some matters are far different from the western thought.i have seen in some western countries they put buddha statues in coffee shops, bars, toilets so for as asians we think thats disrespect because he is a NOble Human who has been worshipped by more than 2550 years by billions of people. so buddha statue is not for bring luck or to attract people or a brand name. the buddha statue was build by Kushan Kings the only purpose is to worship and as a guide to attain liberation. so we dnt like it to be use as commercial item
Sabbe Saththa Bhavanthu SukhiThaththa...!


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