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The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version) - Page 2 - Dhamma Wheel

The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

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kc2dpt
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Re: The Ethics of Non Action

Postby kc2dpt » Wed Feb 11, 2009 8:08 pm

- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby retrofuturist » Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:58 pm

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:45 am

Retro,

I cannot recall a single instance in the suttas of the Buddha referring to one being killing another being as wholesome. Furthermore one being killing another is always mentioned as unwholesome. As far as I know, the Classical Theravada teaching on the matter is that one being killing another is always underpinned by unwholesome mind-states.

If you want to debate whether killing can be wholesome, I think it's off-topic to this thread. You may wish to start a new thread on it. I know this is a topic which has been discussed at length over at E-S.
- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:57 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:49 am

Greetings,

In looking at The Ethics of Non Action it may be useful also to look at...

CRITERIA FOR JUDGING THE UNWHOLESOMENESS OF ACTIONS IN THE TEXTS OF
THERAVADA BUDDHISM
- PETER HARVEY

http://www.buddhistethics.org/2/harvey.txt

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby retrofuturist » Thu Feb 12, 2009 5:09 am

"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby Jechbi » Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:07 am

a link. It makes sense, but to me it's still shocking. If nothing else, it seems like a poor example to those who might erroneously regard themselves as arahants and believe in ignorance that it's okay to commit suicide. But it supports the contention that even the act of killing can be unexpectedly nuanced in terms of kamma (or lack thereof).

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:33 pm

- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby bodom » Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:37 pm

To study is to know the texts,
To practice is to know your defilements,
To attain the goal is to know and let go.

- Ajahn Lee Dhammadharo


With mindfulness immersed in the body
well established, restrained
with regard to the six media of contact,
always centered, the monk
can know Unbinding for himself.

- Ud 3.5


https://www.dhammatalks.org/index.html
http://www.ajahnchah.org/

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:44 pm

- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby bodom » Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:48 pm

To study is to know the texts,
To practice is to know your defilements,
To attain the goal is to know and let go.

- Ajahn Lee Dhammadharo


With mindfulness immersed in the body
well established, restrained
with regard to the six media of contact,
always centered, the monk
can know Unbinding for himself.

- Ud 3.5


https://www.dhammatalks.org/index.html
http://www.ajahnchah.org/

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby BubbaBuddhist » Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:16 pm

Sometimes discussing theory doesn't give me the "flavor" of the situation. In the drowning scenario, let's do this:

Scenario one: A total stranger is drowning.
Scenario two: Your child is drowning.

You don't swim very well and the water is turbulent, so there is a good chance you may drown too if you jump in to rescue the victim.

Examine your mind states in these scenarios. I'll be honest. If it were my child there would be no thought at all; I'd jump in without hesitation. If it were a stranger I'd still probably jump in but there would be a moment of "Oh crap, what am I doing?" right before.

In the second scenario I guess it could be argued I replaced an unwholesome mindstate (fear, hesitation) with a wholesome mindstate.

Now what if you recognize the drowning person as a recently-escaped rapist/murderer/arsonist/terrorist? Would you decide, "kamma. Screw him." :lol: Or dive in and drag him out.

J
Author of Redneck Buddhism: or Will You Reincarnate as Your Own Cousin?

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby Jechbi » Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:37 pm


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:31 pm

- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby clw_uk » Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:38 pm

Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby Ben » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:42 pm

“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

(Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • •

e: [email protected]..

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby clw_uk » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:52 pm

Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:30 am

- Peter


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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby retrofuturist » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:33 am

Greetings Peter,

Thanks for the clarification.

Hopefully venerable Dhammanando can help us out with this once he's better.

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

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Re: The Ethics of Non Action (Classical Theravada version)

Postby kc2dpt » Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:07 am

Clarification to my clarification: There's always the chance I'm misremembering something. :rolleye: And that would be my fault, not my teachers'.
- Peter



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