What about paccaya though? Doesn't one moment arise in dependence on the previous one - in some sense?Anicca wrote: Well, that same 'nothing' persists from one moment to the next in this life too.
P
What about paccaya though? Doesn't one moment arise in dependence on the previous one - in some sense?Anicca wrote: Well, that same 'nothing' persists from one moment to the next in this life too.
Yes - excellent point.porpoise wrote:What about paccaya though? Doesn't one moment arise in dependence on the previous one - in some sense?Anicca wrote: Well, that same 'nothing' persists from one moment to the next in this life too.
P
MettaG. Patthana Pali (the Book of Causal Relationship)
Patthana forming the last book brings together all relationship in a coordinated form to show that the dhamma do not exist as isolated entities but they constitute a well ordered system in which the smallest unit conditions the rest of it and is also being conditioned in return.
The arrangement of the system is so very intricate, complex, highly thorough and complete that it earns for this treatise the reputation of being deep, profound and unfathomable.
It arranges all conditioned things ( 22 tika and 100 duka ) under twenty-four kinds of relations, describes and classifies them into a complete system for understanding the mechanics of the universe of dhamma.
The whole work is divided into four great divisions;
a. the studies of instances in which paccaya relations do exist between the dhammas.
b. the studies of instances in which paccaya relations do not exist between the dhammas.
c. the studies of instances in which some of the paccaya relations do exist between the dhammas
but the others do not.
d. the studies of instances in which some of the paccaya relations not do exist between the dhammas
but others do exist.
The 24 paccaya relations are applied to the four great divisions in six ways ;
a. in their 22 tika group
b. in their 100 duka group
c. in their 100 duka mixed with 22 tika groups
d. in their 22 tika mixed with 100 duka groups
e. in their 22 tika group mixed with one another
f. in their 100 duka group mixed with one another
According to Abhidhamma, citta means "consciousness or mind". But "the citta or consciousness" in Abhidhamma is not as same as the consciousness that we are now understanding.acinteyyo wrote:
My question is: What is the meaningn of "citta" according to Abhidhamma? Consciousness?
best wishes, acinteyyo
To be honest, I don't believe a single word of this nonsense, but this is not subject of this discussion.Soe Win Htut wrote: But "the citta or consciousness" in Abhidhamma is not as same as the consciousness that we are now understanding.
We should not take the mind or consiciousness we are now knowing is similar to citta the Buddha taught as the original truth (ultimate truth).
Because the time duration and the rate of vanishing of Citta (mind), cetasika (metal factors), and Rupa (energies) the Buddha taught as the original truth are totally different that of Citta, cetasika , and Rupa that our perception can now detect.
The time duration of one unit of citta or consciousness or mind consisting of three phases [arising or genesis (uppada) static or development (thiti), and cessation or dissolution (bhanga)] is even less than one-trillionth part of the time occupied by a flash of lightning which lasts for a microsecond (10^-6 second). The subcommentary takes the higher figure of 10^15. The subcommentary said that the mental elements (cittta & cetasika) arise and cease 10^15 x 10^6 = 10^21 times per second. Their extremely short duration is also mentioned in the Anguttara Nikaya.
Does this tell us the Abhidhamma? Why? Any quotes?Soe Win Htut wrote:We should not take the mind or consiciousness we are now knowing is similar to citta the Buddha taught as the original truth (ultimate truth).
Dear Acinteyyo,acinteyyo wrote:To be honest, I don't believe a single word of this nonsense, but this is not subject of this discussion.Soe Win Htut wrote: But "the citta or consciousness" in Abhidhamma is not as same as the consciousness that we are now understanding.
We should not take the mind or consiciousness we are now knowing is similar to citta the Buddha taught as the original truth (ultimate truth).
Because the time duration and the rate of vanishing of Citta (mind), cetasika (metal factors), and Rupa (energies) the Buddha taught as the original truth are totally different that of Citta, cetasika , and Rupa that our perception can now detect.
The time duration of one unit of citta or consciousness or mind consisting of three phases [arising or genesis (uppada) static or development (thiti), and cessation or dissolution (bhanga)] is even less than one-trillionth part of the time occupied by a flash of lightning which lasts for a microsecond (10^-6 second). The subcommentary takes the higher figure of 10^15. The subcommentary said that the mental elements (cittta & cetasika) arise and cease 10^15 x 10^6 = 10^21 times per second. Their extremely short duration is also mentioned in the Anguttara Nikaya.Does this tell us the Abhidhamma? Why? Any quotes?Soe Win Htut wrote:We should not take the mind or consiciousness we are now knowing is similar to citta the Buddha taught as the original truth (ultimate truth).
best wishes, acinteyyo
Hi Soe Win Htut,Soe Win Htut wrote:Dear Acinteyyo,
Sorry for my explanation in reverse order.
"extremely short" is a very elastic term. Can you provide a Sutta from the Anguttara Nikaya which supports your statement?Soe Win Htut wrote:Their extremely short duration is also mentioned in the Anguttara Nikaya.
"It would be better for the uninstructed run-of-the-mill person to hold to the body composed of the four great elements, rather than the mind, as the self. Why is that? Because this body composed of the four great elements is seen standing for a year, two years, three, four, five, ten, twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, a hundred years or more. But what's called 'mind,' 'intellect,' or 'consciousness' by day and by night arises as one thing and ceases as another. Just as a monkey, swinging through a forest wilderness, grabs a branch. Letting go of it, it grabs another branch. Letting go of that, it grabs another one. Letting go of that, it grabs another one. In the same way, what's called 'mind,' 'intellect,' or 'consciousness' by day and by night arises as one thing and ceases as another.
Hi Mike,mikenz66 wrote:This sutta discusses the speed of the mind. Perhaps it's the one Soe Win Htut is thinking of.
SN 12.61 Assutavā Sutta: Uninstructed (1)
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;"It would be better for the uninstructed run-of-the-mill person to hold to the body composed of the four great elements, rather than the mind, as the self. Why is that? Because this body composed of the four great elements is seen standing for a year, two years, three, four, five, ten, twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, a hundred years or more. But what's called 'mind,' 'intellect,' or 'consciousness' by day and by night arises as one thing and ceases as another. Just as a monkey, swinging through a forest wilderness, grabs a branch. Letting go of it, it grabs another branch. Letting go of that, it grabs another one. Letting go of that, it grabs another one. In the same way, what's called 'mind,' 'intellect,' or 'consciousness' by day and by night arises as one thing and ceases as another.
Mike
I have not examined the original text (not sure exactly where to look...) but obviously this is a very modern calculation.The time duration of one unit of citta or consciousness or mind consisting of three phases [arising or genesis (uppada) static or development (thiti), and cessation or dissolution (bhanga)] is even less than one-trillionth part of the time occupied by a flash of lightning which lasts for a microsecond (10^-6 second). The subcommentary takes the higher figure of 10^15. The subcommentary said that the mental elements (cittta & cetasika) arise and cease 10^15 x 10^6 = 10^21 times per second. Their extremely short duration is also mentioned in the Anguttara Nikaya.
"Monks, these three are fabricated characteristics of what is fabricated. Which three? Arising is discernible, passing away is discernible, alteration (literally, other-ness) while staying is discernible.