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Buddhism and Psychedelics - Page 3 - Dhamma Wheel

Buddhism and Psychedelics

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths. What can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
lojong1
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby lojong1 » Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:24 am


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Potato
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Potato » Sun Aug 08, 2010 7:51 pm

There are some religions in which psychedelic use is an accepted practice. Buddhism is not one of them. If you want to experiment with such things, that's up to you, but don't try to legitimize such experimentation as arcane Buddhist practice. To do so is to do both yourself and Buddhism a disservice.

Timothy Leary may have found parts of the Dharma appealing, but I don't think he studied it in great depth.

lojong1
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby lojong1 » Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:46 pm


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Moth
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Moth » Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:29 pm

May you be happy. May you be a peace. May you be free from suffering.
http://www.everythingspirals.com

lojong1
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby lojong1 » Mon Aug 09, 2010 11:08 pm


Kenshou
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Kenshou » Mon Aug 09, 2010 11:40 pm


lojong1
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby lojong1 » Mon Aug 09, 2010 11:58 pm


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jcsuperstar
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Aug 10, 2010 2:49 am

i don't know how this thread got off and on to Aleister Crowley, but there was nothing particularly Buddhist about anything he said, did or taught. and concentration techniques are not
Buddhism although we may use them in Buddhism. I've known people deeply into occult practices and I've read all the recommended literature on the subject to see if the claims made that our two practices overlap and i can say no they don't. practicing breath meditation does not make one a Buddhist, in fact i first learned breath meditation in 3rd grade as a stress relieving practice, nothing Buddhist about that either. Hinduism, taoism, christian mysticism and shamanistic practices use concentration techniques as well, so do remote seeing practices and other "mental cultivation" practices. in fact the first step in any mental training seems to be to sit down and shut up. the similarities tend to end there.



:focus:
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

lojong1
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby lojong1 » Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:46 am


Kenshou
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Kenshou » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:02 am


PeterB
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby PeterB » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:22 am

What the hell is this thread about now ? How did we start with a request to condone drug taking and end up in the alienated loony tune world of Alistair Crowley ?
Or maybe in fact in was a logical and inevitable progession.

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:29 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby jcsuperstar » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:31 am

สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

PeterB
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby PeterB » Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:34 am

Tell me about it....when I first got into Dhamma a group of my friends did too.
The ones that stayed with it were the ones who avoided psychedelics, in the main.

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Moth
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Moth » Wed Aug 11, 2010 5:56 pm

Last edited by Moth on Wed Aug 11, 2010 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
May you be happy. May you be a peace. May you be free from suffering.
http://www.everythingspirals.com

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SDC
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby SDC » Wed Aug 11, 2010 7:25 pm


Goob
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Goob » Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:50 am

I agree with the comments that psychedelics may often lead to delusional thinking and the misguided opinion that one has experienced something "true" as opposed to normal everyday consciousness. However I think most people with little experience of psychedelics mistakenly categorize it as a 'lights & colors' show where magic rainbows explain the meaning of shoes. I have used psychedelics (mainly LSD) on a number of occasions in my younger days and this cliché was never the core of any of my experiences. What stood out as the most important aspect of them was a renewed perspective and my own actions in relation to others wellbeing and my reliance on permanence and material objects. It allowed me to view the effects of many of my actions from a new light and made me want to change certain negative aspects of my behaviour. Surely you could argue how stable this resolve and insight is, but for many people that questioning never comes at all. However, I see it as an incentive and neither a method or a goal in itself.

I think that psychedelics (including marijuana) may offer people from a certain background and mindset the necessary space to question certain assumptions about their lives and their own minds. It may be (note the 'may') beneficial to some people in experiencing what the mind is capable of fabricating, that there is something supramundane (although not necessarily 'true' in the buddhist sense) beyond a house and a mortgage and the occasional beer binge and cruel jokes.

If not for anything else they might be useful for realizing how ultimately unsatisfactory they become after a while when you depend on them for happiness, just like all conditioned things. Most people I've known with experience in psychedelics have eventually realized that it is impossible to cling to the experience and that there is a limit to the perspective they bring.

Surely one also has to credit the influence the psychedelics for the imapct they had on the social and creative movements in the sixties and the way they in their turn helped pave the way for a climate in society which became more fertile for "non-mainstream" religions such as buddhism. I'm sure that most people here would like to think that they would have ultimately found their way to Buddhism as they have now regardless of changes of the past but I am of the opinion that this possibility is intimately tied up with the change in society and among movements in the last five decades.

Also, yes, it may be a fabrication, but as someone pointed out earlier, what isn't a fabrication? As Thanissaro Bhikkhu explains in regards to Mindfulness of Breathing it too is a fabrication but a fabrication you learn to play with until you know how to fabricate it well enough to quiet your mind, and once the mind the calm enough and the will to stop fabricate is strong and trained enough the mind heads in the other direction - non-fabrication, i.e, the Unconditioned. I am not saying that LSD is an equally positive or quieting fabrication to Mindfulness of Breathing but perhaps the understanding of fabrication is equally important there, if it can be understood in that way.

I am not recommending that anyone take psychedelics, nor am I not recommending it. People need to make their own mistakes and realize certain things about unsatisfactoriness for themselves. I wanted however to offer some more nuanced thoughts about what could be useful about certain mistakes as opposed to others who have posted here with much experience of buddhist doctrine but little in terms of experience of psychedelics.

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mpcahn
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby mpcahn » Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:42 am

I have experienced a "Oneness" on Acid it before I got into Buddhism. I spent a year chasing that dragon. Another experience got me started on the path by giving me an extremely sped up vision of samsara and the suffering in it, this led to an extreme sense of samvega and I found Buddhism as a way out. Now I am drug free. I respect that acid got me started on the path but I feel that it would be useless and counterproductive at this point.
is the mind us? Is it ours? Slash on down! Whatever is going to be destroyed, let it be destroyed. We feel no regrets. We want only the truth. (Ajahn Maha Boowa)

Moggalana
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Moggalana » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:18 am

Another opinion:
Let it come. Let it be. Let it go.

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Jaidyn
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Re: Buddhism and Psychedelics

Postby Jaidyn » Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:42 pm

I fear that, if not developed "naturally", these insights and altered/heightened states lend me no good influence over the process. My psyche may finally turn against me as I experience the states or the absence of the states, because I lack the mental fitness or insights to reach there by myself or to stay there in a good way.

As to the chemical alteration of the brain: we say drugs chemically alter the brain. Where do we draw the line to define bad alterations? Is the criteria for bad alteration when it comes in form of a certain pill or the alike?

Tricycle: AWAKENING WITH PROZAC: Pharmaceuticals and Practice
http://www.tricycle.com/feature/awakeni ... d-practice

(From Buddhist perspective I guess its bad when not used to cure illness)


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