Suicide and Euthanasia according to Theravada

[Viscid]

Arahants shouldn't be equated to 'Saints.' They are those who are no longer deluded by the sense of self, and will no longer be reborn. If he commits suicide, it's of little consequence and thus not immoral. Only an arahat can know whether or not it is truly justified to commit suicide.

A 'saint' is a guy who's impressed enough people with miracles and charisma to be declared a saint.

[tiltbillings]

Arahats shouldn't be equated to 'Saints.' They are those who are no longer deluded by the sense of self, and will no longer be reborn. If he commits suicide, it's of little consequence and thus not immoral. Only an arahat can know whether or not it is truly justified to commit suicide.

A 'saint' is a guy who's impressed enough people with miracles and charisma to be declared a saint.

Why would an arahant khimself? What motivation would there be? Dukkha? That is the underlying motivation of most worldy suicides.

[Viscid]

Why would an arahant khimself? What motivation would there be? Dukkha? That is the underlying motivation of most worldy suicides.

The only reason that could rationally justify their suicide is that they see their existence as being burdensome to the Sangha, especially during times where food or medical support is scarse. If they killed themselves for any aversion, then they are no arahant.

[Alex123]

Why would an arahant khimself? What motivation would there be? Dukkha? That is the underlying motivation of most worldy suicides.

Why not? Why couldn't Arahant kill himself to stop painful bodily feelings? 5 aggregates are anicca, dukkha and anatta - regardless of whethere one has craving for them or not.

[Viscid]

Why not? Why couldn't Arahant kill himself to stop painful bodily feelings?

If I understand correctly, they'd see pain as equal to any other sensation.

Just pain, just pleasure: neither aversion nor attraction to either.

[tiltbillings]

Why would an arahant khimself? What motivation would there be? Dukkha? That is the underlying motivation of most worldy suicides.

Why not? Why couldn't Arahant kill himself to stop painful bodily feelings?

Sounds like aversion.

[Alex123]

Why would an arahant khimself? What motivation would there be? Dukkha? That is the underlying motivation of most worldy suicides.

Why not? Why couldn't Arahant kill himself to stop painful bodily feelings?

Sounds like aversion.

Merely a decision to avoid painful feeling. Why feel so much pain when you can end it?


If an arahant is walking and sees a cliff on the path, would he walk around the cliff or walk off a cliff and severely get hurt?

Was his choice to change the walking path due to aversion to falling of the cliff, or was it due to avoiding painful feelings?

[rowyourboat]

I think an arahanth would see pain as pain and not something he wants to go through again and again. Even the Buddha requested his robes to be folded and made into a seat when he was quite old and his body was tired. I think the difference is that his mind is not shaken by the pain- there is no reaction, no agitation at all- the samadhi state would simply continue. However he would know through wisdom that this pain is a sign that the body needs a rest or needs food or needs to remove itself from the object which is causing it pain. So he would simply do that.

with metta

Matheesha

[Viscid]

I think the difference is that his mind is not shaken by the pain- there is no reaction, no agitation at all- the samadhi state would simply continue. However he would know through wisdom that this pain is a sign that the body needs a rest or needs food or needs to remove itself from the object which is causing it pain. So he would simply do that.

Aye, rationality decrees that if you're experiencing pain, it's likely best for your health and well-being to mitigate its cause. Embracing pain without reason is simply self-destructive.

[Alex123]

Embracing pain without reason is simply self-destructive.

Right. Maybe that was one of the reasons that Buddha relinquished his vitality/fabrications. His old body was giving Hi, lots of painful feelings. His Dhamma was set. He has done his mission (which required Brahma to beg Him to do). Buddha had no clinging to life.

[Individual]

i think an arahant would

i dont think an arahant would

an arahant would

an arahant wouldn't

i think the buddha

but the buddha is, isn't, would, and would not

Why feel so much pain when you can end it?

[Ceisiwr]

Alex123 wrote:
Why feel so much pain when you can end it

Some people do because there is no wisdom

[Alex123]

Some people do because there is no wisdom

Are you saying that Buddha had no wisdom?

Maybe some hasten their parinibbana to end dukkha.

Even the Buddha could experience Dukkha, kilamatho and vihesā.

"At present I am living hemmed in by bhikkhus and bhikkhunis... by sectarian teachers and their disciples, and I live in discomfort and not at ease. Ākiṇṇo dukkhaṃ. Na phāsu viharati. Suppose I were to live alone, secluded from the crowd?"
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .irel.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... ml#pts.041" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Then the thought occurred to me, 'This Dhamma that I have attained is deep, hard to see, hard to realize, peaceful, refined, beyond the scope of conjecture, subtle, to-be-experienced by the wise. [3] But this generation delights in attachment, is excited by attachment, enjoys attachment. For a generation delighting in attachment, excited by attachment, enjoying attachment, this/that conditionality & dependent co-arising are hard to see. This state, too, is hard to see: the resolution of all fabrications, the relinquishment of all acquisitions, the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding
And if I were to teach the Dhamma and others would not understand me, that would be tiresome for me, troublesome for me ...so mamassa kilamatho, sā mamassa vihesāti.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

kilamatho =fatigue; weariness.
vihesā= vexation; annoyance; injury.So not only in Ud 4.5 , but in MN26 we have another example of what can occur to the Buddha.