no attachement = no expectations

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puppha
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no attachement = no expectations

Post by puppha »

Dear Dhamma friends,

The following thought occurred to me: "no attachement = no expectations"

Not being attached to a car, a house, money, a person, etc. would be the same as not expecting anything out of that car, that house, that money, that person.
On the other side, if you have no expectations about an object, a person, or an idea, would that not be the same as not being attached to that object, person or idea?

What are your opinions?

Metta
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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Bhikkhu Pesala »

No attachment = no opinions ? :stirthepot:
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DAWN
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by DAWN »

Expectation is suffering
No expectation, no suffering
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english
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Cittasanto
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Cittasanto »

puppha wrote:Dear Dhamma friends,

The following thought occurred to me: "no attachement = no expectations"

Not being attached to a car, a house, money, a person, etc. would be the same as not expecting anything out of that car, that house, that money, that person.
On the other side, if you have no expectations about an object, a person, or an idea, would that not be the same as not being attached to that object, person or idea?

What are your opinions?

Metta
I have no attachment to the US elections, doesn't mean I don't have an expectation or opinion about them as I find it quite interesting. same with UK elections. neither have a direct impact on my life, but that doesn't mean I am attached or lack expectations either way round.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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ground
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by ground »

puppha wrote:The following thought occurred to me: "no attachement = no expectations"

Not being attached to a car, a house, money, a person, etc. would be the same as not expecting anything out of that car, that house, that money, that person.
On the other side, if you have no expectations about an object, a person, or an idea, would that not be the same as not being attached to that object, person or idea?

What are your opinions?
Expecting a form to be {this or that} a form is perceived as being {this or that}.
Expecting a sound to be {this or that} a sound is perceived as being {this or that}.
Expecting a smell ...
Expecting an idea to be more than merely an idea an idea is perceived as being "true". :sage:
SarathW
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by SarathW »

Hi Puppha
To me none attachment means seen the objects in terms of Three basic facts of existence. Ie Egolessness, Unsatisfactoryness and Impermanence

Please see more details in the following link and select the relevant article.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/bpslist.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
pegembara
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by pegembara »

When anicca is fully accepted there is no expectations. Every breath may well be the last. There is absolutely no expectations of anything.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.
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puppha
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by puppha »

Many thanks to all contributors, there are good comments here that got me thinking!

Let's do a bit of logic.

If I am clinging to something, then it looks to me that I must have expecations about what that thing will bring to me.
If I am not clinging to something, then I think it implies that I am not expecting anything from it.
If I have expectations about something, then I will be happy if it gives the desired results, and unhappy if it won't; so I am clinging to it.
If I have no expectations about something, can I still be attached to it? I don't know on this one...
Cittasanto wrote:I have no attachment to the US elections, doesn't mean I don't have an expectation or opinion about them as I find it quite interesting. same with UK elections. neither have a direct impact on my life, but that doesn't mean I am attached or lack expectations either way round.
I find this a bit difficult to understand...
How is it possible to have an interest in something and have no expectations/opinions about it?
In the example you gave, I would tend to favour one candidate over the other. I would hope that the candidate who is more likely to bring peace and well-being for all people would be elected. And I would be disappointed if (s)he is not...

Metta
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Cittasanto
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Cittasanto »

puppha wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:I have no attachment to the US elections, doesn't mean I don't have an expectation or opinion about them as I find it quite interesting. same with UK elections. neither have a direct impact on my life, but that doesn't mean I am attached or lack expectations either way round.
I find this a bit difficult to understand...
How is it possible to have an interest in something and have no expectations/opinions about it?
Did I imply that somewhere?
see the underlined part, I said I do have an opinion and expectation, but now the result is in I am hardly moved by it. the election wasn't a personal thing in any way for me Obama or Romney didn't have to win or loose for me to be happy or disappointed.
In the example you gave, I would tend to favour one candidate over the other. I would hope that the candidate who is more likely to bring peace and well-being for all people would be elected. And I would be disappointed if (s)he is not...
that is taking it personally, if there is no personal investment there is no attachment.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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Mr Man
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Mr Man »

Cittasanto wrote:
puppha wrote:Dear Dhamma friends,


I have no attachment to the US elections.
I imagine that you do have attachment and that will affect your perception of the US elections.
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Mr Man »

DAWN wrote:Expectation is suffering
No expectation, no suffering
Or

Expectation is suffering
No expectation is suffering

What are the expectations of a rabbit?
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Cittasanto
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Cittasanto »

Mr Man wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:
puppha wrote:Dear Dhamma friends,


I have no attachment to the US elections.
I imagine that you do have attachment and that will affect your perception of the US elections.
you may wish to read the part after the comma.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill
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DAWN
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by DAWN »

Mr Man wrote:
DAWN wrote:Expectation is suffering
No expectation, no suffering
Or

Expectation is suffering
No expectation is suffering

What are the expectations of a rabbit?
Actuly i dont see what you mean by "No expectation is suffering", perharps that suffering is something more global, and not totaly depends on expectation? If it is, i'am agree with you, all existance is suffering, with or without expectation.

Expectation of a rabbit is expectation to survive, to reproduse himself.
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english
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Mr Man
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Mr Man »

Cittasanto wrote: you may wish to read the part after the comma.
I did.
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Mr Man
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Re: no attachement = no expectations

Post by Mr Man »

DAWN wrote:

Expectation of a rabbit is expectation to survive, to reproduse himself.
I'm not sure if survival and reproduction would be expectation - more instinct.
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