Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

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SarathW
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Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?
I just wonder why we instruct people to follow the Noble Eightfold Path, not the NTP?
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Sam Vara
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by Sam Vara »

Do you mean without Right Knowledge and Right Release?

My simple guess is that there are, canonically, far more references to the Eightfold Path than to the ten; and that the sutta which is held by tradition to be the Buddha's first has eight.
SarathW
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

Do you mean without Right Knowledge and Right Release?
Yes
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by StormBorn »

SarathW wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 9:20 am Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?
I just wonder why we instruct people to follow the Noble Eightfold Path, not the NTP?
Because, Noble Eightfold Path is the "Path". Right Knowledge and Right Release are the destination. We follow the Path and reach the destination. We don't follow the destination. It's cause & effect, actually.

That's what a very wise monk said to the same question. But these days, some even try to practise the result also. Which one the smart Sarath follow? :sage: :tongue:
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by Spiny Norman »

SarathW wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 9:20 am Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?
Please, no more, I can't even cope with eight. :tongue:
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SarathW
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

What is the Sutta relating to Tenfold analysis?
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Sam Vara
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by Sam Vara »

SarathW wrote: Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:21 am What is the Sutta relating to Tenfold analysis?
MN 117 has this:
In this context, right view comes first. And how does right view come first? For one of right view, wrong view is worn away. And the many bad, unskillful qualities that arise because of wrong view are worn away. And because of right view, many skillful qualities are developed to perfection. For one of right thought, wrong thought is worn away. … For one of right speech, wrong speech is worn away. … For one of right action, wrong action is worn away. … For one of right livelihood, wrong livelihood is worn away. … For one of right effort, wrong effort is worn away. … For one of right mindfulness, wrong mindfulness is worn away. … For one of right immersion, wrong immersion is worn away. … For one of right knowledge, wrong knowledge is worn away. … For one of right freedom, wrong freedom is worn away.
which makes ten.
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by dharmacorps »

Like others have said, I feel like the other 2 describe the completion of the path. The 9th and 10th would be more like the icing on the cake.
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

Noble Eightfold Path is the "Path". Right Knowledge and Right Release are the destination.
Thanks all.
This is my understanding too.
Noble Eightfold Path is the Magga (Path). Right Knowledge and Right releases are the (Phala) fruit or the result.
It seems, it is inaccurate to say Tenfold Path even though sometimes we use this term.
=========
"the Buddha makes a similar distinction between the noble eightfold path of stream-entry and the tenfold path of Arahantship."

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/aut ... part2.html
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by form »

The higher the number, the more likely it is a product of more addition and editing. This is a theory i read from some scholar book. Which book i dun remember now. The more theoretical a dhamma is presented the less practical it will be, this is my view.
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by BKh »

It seems, it is inaccurate to say Tenfold Path even though sometimes we use this term.
It's inaccurate because there is no such term. I believe you just made it up. It's true there is a set of ten factors that have right and wrong, like the Eightfold Path does. But, unless I am mistaken, there is never a tenfold path as such mentioned anywhere.
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

I believe you just made it up.
No. It is used in many places. As you have seen in my above post even Ven. Thannisaro used the same term even though it appeared to be the wrong usage.
======
Tenfold Path
In the Mahācattārīsaka Sutta[46][47] which appears in the Chinese and Pali canons, the Buddha explains that cultivation of the noble eightfold path of a learner leads to the development of two further paths of the Arahants, which are right knowledge, or insight (sammā-ñāṇa), and right liberation, or release (sammā-vimutti).[48] These two factors fall under the category of wisdom (paññā).[49]

The Noble Eightfold Path, in the Buddhist traditions, is the direct means to nirvana and brings a release from the cycle of life and death in the realms of samsara.[50][51]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_Eig ... nfold_Path
Last edited by SarathW on Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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SarathW
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by SarathW »

"Of those, right view is the forerunner. And how is right view the forerunner? In one of right view, right resolve comes into being. In one of right resolve, right speech comes into being. In one of right speech, right action... In one of right action, right livelihood... In one of right livelihood, right effort... In one of right effort, right mindfulness... In one of right mindfulness, right concentration... In one of right concentration, right knowledge... In one of right knowledge, right release comes into being. [4] Thus the learner is endowed with eight factors, and the arahant with ten.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by BKh »

SarathW wrote: Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:38 pm
I believe you just made it up.
No. It is used in many places.
Very sorry. What I should have written is that there is no such term as "Noble Tenfold Path" which is what you wrote in your OP.

But I would still be curious if the term "tenfold path" as such is found in the Suttas. I don't believe that it is. Sorry if I am being too picky.
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Re: Why don't we follow Noble Tenfold Path?

Post by DooDoot »

form wrote: Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:33 pm The higher the number, the more likely it is a product of more addition and editing. This is a theory i read from some scholar book. Which book i dun remember now. The more theoretical a dhamma is presented the less practical it will be, this is my view.
The term sammāvimutti is found in lots of sutta, here; and sammāñāṇassa, here.
BKh wrote: Wed Oct 24, 2018 2:24 am Sorry if I am being too picky.
Your inquiry appears most relevant (since an Arahant is probably not walking a path anymore since they reached the destination).
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