N8P - Gradual or not gradual ?

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Antaradhana
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Re: N8P - Gradual or not gradual ?

Post by Antaradhana »

Nwad wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2019 4:35 pm
Antaradhana wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:38 pm The sequence of stages of the Eightfold Path of Aryans is the most optimal.
Hello _/\_
So for you there is no possible development of one stage without fully developed previous ?
Hi
It is reckless to try to swim over a stormy stream without learning to swim.
All that is subject to arising is subject to termination, all formations are non-permanent. And that which is impermanent is suffering. Regarding what is impermanent and prone to suffering, one cannot say: "This is mine, I am this, this is my self".
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bkmudita
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Re: N8P - Gradual or not gradual ?

Post by bkmudita »

interesting point that the eight factors are not sequential, there are suttas can support this:

1. in the AN 4 V. ROHITASSA 41 Samādhi bhāvanā suttaṃ (Development of Samādhi Sutta)

“Bhikkhus, there are these four developments of samādhi (Samādhi Bhāvanā). What four? (1) There is a development of samādhi that leads to dwelling happily in this very life. (2) There is a development of samādhi that leads to obtaining knowledge and vision. (3) There is a development of samādhi that leads to mindfulness and wise discernment. (4) There is a development of samādhi that leads to the destruction of the taints. "

Here the mindfulness and wise discernment (clear comprehension), comes after developing concentration (samadhi) and wisdom(from knowledge and vision), which hints mindfulness strength (bala) need to be used to direct concentration and wisdom strengths of the mind to the destruction of taints/fetters.

2. in the AN 4:170 (10) In Conjunction

“Friends, whatever bhikkhu or bhikkhunī has declared the attainment of arahantship in my presence has done so by these four paths or by a certain one among them. What four?
(1) “Here, a bhikkhu develops Pañña preceded by Samadhi. As he is developing Pañña preceded by Samadhi, the path is generated. He pursues this path, develops it, and cultivates it. As he is pursuing, developing, and cultivating this path, the fetters are abandoned and the underlying tendencies are uprooted.
(2) “Again, a bhikkhu develops Samadhi preceded by Pañña. As he is developing Samadhi preceded by Pañña, the path is generated. He pursues this path, develops it, and cultivates it. As he is pursuing, developing, and cultivating this path, the fetters are abandoned and the underlying tendencies are uprooted.
(3) “Again, a bhikkhu develops Samadhi and Pañña in conjunction. As he is developing Samadhi and Pañña in conjunction, the path is generated. He pursues this path, develops it, and cultivates it. As he is pursuing, developing, and cultivating this path, the fetters are abandoned and the underlying tendencies are uprooted.
(4) “Again, a bhikkhu’s mind is seized by restlessness about the Dhamma. But there comes an occasion when his mind becomes internally steady, composed, unified, and concentrated. Then the path is generated in him. He pursues this path, develops it, and cultivates it. As he is pursuing, developing, and cultivating this path, the fetters are abandoned and the underlying tendencies are uprooted.
“Whatever bhikkhu or bhikkhunī, friends, has declared the attainment of arahantship in my presence has done so by these four paths or by a certain one among them.”

So here there are different liberation paths based on different sequence of developing concentration and wisdom, etc.
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