what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
Post Reply
User avatar
confusedlayman
Posts: 4284
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
Location: Human Realm (as of now)

what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by confusedlayman »

there is a sutta by ven. ananda or sariputta or ven.cunda (i dont remember)

in that the teaching (ven ananda or sariputta) will say that ending of conciousness means just reminderless ending of conciousness... this sutta will dispell doubts of soul or something enduring with cessation of conciouisness

however this sutta when read also lead to 4 stage for some people ...

i would like to know this sutta name and link as i cant find it for many months ...
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
User avatar
SDC
Posts: 6735
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:08 pm

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by SDC »

Quite a few suttas from Nidāna Saṃyutta refer to the "remainderless fading away and cessation" of the different layers of DO, consciousness being one of them.
"As fruits fall from the tree, so people too, both young and old, fall when this body breaks." - Raṭṭhapāla (MN 82)
Pārāpariya | Phussa | Subhā of Jīvaka’s Mango Grove | Kappa
User avatar
dhammacoustic
Posts: 934
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:30 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by dhammacoustic »

confusedlayman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm there is a sutta by ven. ananda or sariputta or ven.cunda (i dont remember)

in that the teaching (ven ananda or sariputta) will say that ending of conciousness means just reminderless ending of conciousness... this sutta will dispell doubts of soul or something enduring with cessation of conciouisness

however this sutta when read also lead to 4 stage for some people ...

i would like to know this sutta name and link as i cant find it for many months ...
kotthita sutta perhaps?

vinnana doesn't mean consciousness , it means "phenomenal distinction"... the sutta doesn't deny the subject , on the contrary, it describes how one is liberated through getting rid of all phenomena, ie objectivity..
User avatar
confusedlayman
Posts: 4284
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
Location: Human Realm (as of now)

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by confusedlayman »

dhammacoustic wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:30 am
confusedlayman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm there is a sutta by ven. ananda or sariputta or ven.cunda (i dont remember)

in that the teaching (ven ananda or sariputta) will say that ending of conciousness means just reminderless ending of conciousness... this sutta will dispell doubts of soul or something enduring with cessation of conciouisness

however this sutta when read also lead to 4 stage for some people ...

i would like to know this sutta name and link as i cant find it for many months ...
kotthita sutta perhaps?

vinnana doesn't mean consciousness , it means "phenomenal distinction"... the sutta doesn't deny the subject , on the contrary, it describes how one is liberated through getting rid of all phenomena, ie objectivity..
u mean get rid of all phenomena by not cognizing it as this or that (fixed image?)
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
User avatar
dhammacoustic
Posts: 934
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:30 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by dhammacoustic »

confusedlayman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:53 am u mean get rid of all phenomena by not cognizing it as this or that (fixed image?)
no. i mean getting rid of self-objectification / false identification : "i am this , this is me , this is myself"...

your cognitions and perceptions should be as clear and sharp as they can get , you should even train your senses for it..
User avatar
confusedlayman
Posts: 4284
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
Location: Human Realm (as of now)

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by confusedlayman »

dhammacoustic wrote: Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:16 am
confusedlayman wrote: Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:53 am u mean get rid of all phenomena by not cognizing it as this or that (fixed image?)
no. i mean getting rid of self-objectification / false identification : "i am this , this is me , this is myself"...

your cognitions and perceptions should be as clear and sharp as they can get , you should even train your senses for it..
Ok thanks. I am again re-reading vism with line by line on wisdom and purification of views...
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
User avatar
DooDoot
Posts: 9988
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:06 pm

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by DooDoot »

confusedlayman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm in that the teaching (ven ananda or sariputta) will say that ending of conciousness means just reminderless ending of conciousness...
unlikely. the suttas do refer to the remainderless ending of ignorance (SN 12.2) & craving (SN 56.11; SN 12.44)

since Ven. Sariputta in MN 43 says wisdom & consciousness are co-joined, why would Ven. Sariputta refer to ending consciousness?
If a monk abandons passion for the property of consciousness, then owing to the abandonment of passion, the support is cut off, and there is no landing of consciousness. Consciousness, thus not having landed, not increasing, not concocting, is released. Owing to its release, it is steady. Owing to its steadiness, it is contented. Owing to its contentment, it is not agitated. Not agitated, he (the monk) is totally unbound right within. He discerns that 'Birth is ended, the holy life fulfilled, the task done. There is nothing further for this world.'

SN 22.53
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
justindesilva
Posts: 1417
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:38 pm

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by justindesilva »

confusedlayman wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:36 pm there is a sutta by ven. ananda or sariputta or ven.cunda (i dont remember)

in that the teaching (ven ananda or sariputta) will say that ending of conciousness means just reminderless ending of conciousness... this sutta will dispell doubts of soul or something enduring with cessation of conciouisness

however this sutta when read also lead to 4 stage for some people ...

i would like to know this sutta name and link as i cant find it for many months ...
It is sammadiththi Sutta explained by Ven. Sariputta thero as accepted by Lord buddha.
Here with consciousness is said to understand origin of consciousness , the way of consciousness and ending consciousness. It makes the way of ending suffering ( 58th verse).
User avatar
cappuccino
Posts: 5700
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:45 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by cappuccino »

consciousness isn't the word Buddha used


we must be careful


something may be lost in translation
Art requires philosophy, just as philosophy requires art. Otherwise, what would become of beauty? ―Paul Gauguin
Good for Your Soul
justindesilva
Posts: 1417
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:38 pm

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by justindesilva »

cappuccino wrote: Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:39 pm consciousness isn't the word Buddha used


we must be careful


something may be lost in translation
May I suggest that consciousness ( used in translations) can be replaced with citta (wholesome or unwholesome) or Mana or mano.
There are many foreign words to English adopted by the English language in the absence of proper words.
User avatar
cappuccino
Posts: 5700
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:45 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by cappuccino »

justindesilva wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:39 am May I suggest that consciousness can be replaced with citta
I don't know,


I know the goal is everlasting
Art requires philosophy, just as philosophy requires art. Otherwise, what would become of beauty? ―Paul Gauguin
Good for Your Soul
User avatar
equilibrium
Posts: 338
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:07 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by equilibrium »

cappuccino wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:44 am
justindesilva wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:39 am May I suggest that consciousness can be replaced with citta
I don't know,

I know the goal is everlasting
Would the word “awareness” appeal to you?
User avatar
cappuccino
Posts: 5700
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:45 am

Re: what is the sutta that says the ending of conciousness..

Post by cappuccino »

equilibrium wrote: Wed Oct 21, 2020 11:43 am Would the word “awareness” appeal to you?
the Blessed One would not say, 'A monk with no more effluents, on the break-up of the body, is annihilated,
perishes, & does not exist after death.'

Yamaka Sutta
Art requires philosophy, just as philosophy requires art. Otherwise, what would become of beauty? ―Paul Gauguin
Good for Your Soul
Post Reply