Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
What are the benefits of rebirth in Tushita heaven? Is it possible to practice there? What kind of pleasures are experienced. I understand a fair amount of Theravada monks seek such a rebirth. Some in Mahayana too.
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Pure Land Buddhism had two goals. Rebirth in a place conducive to becoming a Buddha is the long term goal, for after this life. The short term goal is to learn to see where you are in this life as a Pure Land. I haven't ever heard of a Theravada equivalent.
Have you been watching the tv show "The Good Place"? It says that it has become impossible to be good enough to earn a place in The Good Place after death because life has become too complicated. Everything has unintended negative consequences. Being in a Pure Land where you live Dhamma your entire life and avoid temptation would go a long way toward finding Nibbana.
Have you been watching the tv show "The Good Place"? It says that it has become impossible to be good enough to earn a place in The Good Place after death because life has become too complicated. Everything has unintended negative consequences. Being in a Pure Land where you live Dhamma your entire life and avoid temptation would go a long way toward finding Nibbana.
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Yes, thanks, but I'm not talking about Pure Land Buddhism. I'm just talking about a Theravada follower seeking the next life in Tushita heaven. Or anyone else.
In Mahayana there is a Tushita deva realm and there is a Tushita Pure Land, "the inner court" where Maitreya lives.
In Mahayana there is a Tushita deva realm and there is a Tushita Pure Land, "the inner court" where Maitreya lives.
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
You could look up Ajahn Punnadhammo's book on Buddhist Cosmology. It gives a detailed, doctrinal overview on each of the heavens, heavenly beings, etc. Google it, you can download it for free from his website.
By and large though, I'd advise you to aim higher than Tusita.
By and large though, I'd advise you to aim higher than Tusita.
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Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Become a follower of Maitreya there. Do you think He will not lead you to the Highest Wisdom? If that is where you want to be reborn, that is where you will go directly. You can even visit there now. It has to be what you want, but Buddhism doesn't withhold it's Peaceful comings and goings from those who are Peaceful.
That sage who has perfect insight,
at the summit of spiritual perfection:
that’s who I call a brahmin.
-Dhammapada.
at the summit of spiritual perfection:
that’s who I call a brahmin.
-Dhammapada.
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Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
If u dont want to practice now whats the sureity that u will practice in heaven?
Evwn if buddha wants u to practice and if u dont want u wont
Rebirth in tusita needs genority, 5 precept, and basic things like good laylife
Evwn if buddha wants u to practice and if u dont want u wont
Rebirth in tusita needs genority, 5 precept, and basic things like good laylife
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
I do practice now.confusedlayman wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 8:41 am If u dont want to practice now whats the sureity that u will practice in heaven?
Evwn if buddha wants u to practice and if u dont want u wont
Rebirth in tusita needs genority, 5 precept, and basic things like good laylife
I don't think you know what you're talking about.
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
How would anyone here know the answers to your questions? If someone did answer your questions would you believe them? How would you know if they are right or not?
In tusita heaven you get a pair of wings and a halo....you can practice but only the harp and choral music....all the drugs like cocaine and heroin are there but you don't get addicted or have any adverse effects so you just kick back and enjoy.
Like the lady sings in Eraserhead:
chownahIn Heaven
Everything is fine
In Heaven
Everything is fine
In Heaven
Everything is fine
You got your good thing
And I've got mine
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
I thought some may have some textual citations. I will check the website mentioned above.chownah wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:16 pmHow would anyone here know the answers to your questions? If someone did answer your questions would you believe them? How would you know if they are right or not?
In tusita heaven you get a pair of wings and a halo....you can practice but only the harp and choral music....all the drugs like cocaine and heroin are there but you don't get addicted or have any adverse effects so you just kick back and enjoy.
Like the lady sings in Eraserhead:chownahIn Heaven
Everything is fine
In Heaven
Everything is fine
In Heaven
Everything is fine
You got your good thing
And I've got mine
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Majjhima 120:
".....Furthermore, take a mendicant who has faith, ethics, learning, generosity, and wisdom. And they’ve heard: ‘The Gods of the Thirty-Three … the Gods of Yama … the Joyful Gods … the Gods Who Love to Create … the Gods Who Control the Creations of Others are long-lived, beautiful, and very happy.’ They think: ‘If only, when my body breaks up, after death, I would be reborn in the company of the Gods Who Control the Creations of Others!’ They settle on that thought, stabilize it and develop it. Those choices and aspirations of theirs, developed and cultivated like this, lead to rebirth there. This is the path and the practice that leads to rebirth there......
......Furthermore, take a mendicant who has faith, ethics, learning, generosity, and wisdom. They think: ‘If only I might realize the undefiled freedom of heart and freedom by wisdom in this very life, and live having realized it with my own insight due to the ending of defilements.’ They realize the undefiled freedom of heart and freedom by wisdom in this very life. And they live having realized it with their own insight due to the ending of defilements. And, mendicants, that mendicant is not reborn anywhere.”
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Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
You'll be taller than a Yāma deva, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva. Your life-span will be longer than a Yāma deva's, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva's. The apsaras will be sexier than in the Yāma heaven, but not as sexy as the ones in Nimmānaratī. Etc., etc.
It would be if you were reborn there after attaining stream-entry or higher in the human realm (like Anāthapiṇḍika and Isidatta) or if a Buddha were to visit the heaven during your stay. Pace Mahabrahma, there's no support in Theravāda sources for the idea that Metteyya teaches anybody there; being merely an ignorant bodhisatta, Metteyya is still a puthujjana and therefore not yet in a position to teach an ariya-making Dhamma.
A plenitude of five-sense-door consciousnesses with ati-iṭṭhārammaṇas ("highly desirable objects") as their object.
If you ever meet one you should tell the feckless wastrel that he's taken a wrong course. Cite the Methuna and Nanda Suttas if he doesn't believe you:
“Here, brahmin, some ascetic or brahmin, claiming to be perfectly celibate, does not engage in sexual intercourse with women. He does not consent to being rubbed, massaged, bathed, and kneaded by them. He does not joke with women, play with them, and amuse himself with them. He does not gaze and stare straight into women’s eyes. He does not listen to the voices of women behind a wall or through a rampart as they laugh, talk, sing, or weep. He does not recollect laughing, talking, and playing with women in the past. He does not look at a householder or a householder’s son enjoying himself furnished and endowed with the five objects of sensual pleasure. Yet he lives the spiritual life aspiring for rebirth in a certain order of devas, thinking: ‘By this virtuous behavior, observance, austerity, or spiritual life I will be a deva or one in the retinue of the devas.’ He relishes this, desires it, and finds satisfaction in it. This, too, is a breach, flaw, blemish, and blotch of the celibate life. He is called one who lives an impure celibate life, one who is fettered by the bond of sexuality. He is not freed from birth, from old age and death, from sorrow, lamentation, pain, dejection, and anguish; he is not freed from suffering, I say.”
(Methuna Sutta, AN. 7.47)
Then venerable Nanda’s monk-friends accosted venerable Nanda with words about a hireling, with words about a lackey, saying: “It seems venerable Nanda is a hireling, it seems venerable Nanda is a lackey, he is living the spiritual life for the sake of celestial nymphs, the Blessed One, it seems, is his surety for gaining five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs!”
(Ud. 3.2)
Yena yena hi maññanti,
tato taṃ hoti aññathā.
In whatever way they conceive it,
It turns out otherwise.
(Sn. 588)
tato taṃ hoti aññathā.
In whatever way they conceive it,
It turns out otherwise.
(Sn. 588)
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Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
you sound skepticalDhammanando wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:29 pmYou'll be taller than a Yāma deva, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva. Your life-span will be longer than a Yāma deva's, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva's. The apsaras will be sexier than in the Yāma heaven, but not as sexy as the ones in Nimmānaratī. Etc., etc.
though it makes logical sense
in terms of karma
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
That's interesting Bhante. Thanks for your input. Gave me a good chuckle too!Dhammanando wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 9:29 pmYou'll be taller than a Yāma deva, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva. Your life-span will be longer than a Yāma deva's, but shorter than a Nimmānaratī deva's. The apsaras will be sexier than in the Yāma heaven, but not as sexy as the ones in Nimmānaratī. Etc., etc.
It would be if you were reborn there after attaining stream-entry or higher in the human realm (like Anāthapiṇḍika and Isidatta) or if a Buddha were to visit the heaven during your stay. Pace Mahabrahma, there's no support in Theravāda sources for the idea that Metteyya teaches anybody there; being merely an ignorant bodhisatta, Metteyya is still a puthujjana and therefore not yet in a position to teach an ariya-making Dhamma.
A plenitude of five-sense-door consciousnesses with ati-iṭṭhārammaṇas ("highly desirable objects") as their object.
If you ever meet one you should tell the feckless wastrel that he's taken a wrong course. Cite the Methuna and Nanda Suttas if he doesn't believe you:
“Here, brahmin, some ascetic or brahmin, claiming to be perfectly celibate, does not engage in sexual intercourse with women. He does not consent to being rubbed, massaged, bathed, and kneaded by them. He does not joke with women, play with them, and amuse himself with them. He does not gaze and stare straight into women’s eyes. He does not listen to the voices of women behind a wall or through a rampart as they laugh, talk, sing, or weep. He does not recollect laughing, talking, and playing with women in the past. He does not look at a householder or a householder’s son enjoying himself furnished and endowed with the five objects of sensual pleasure. Yet he lives the spiritual life aspiring for rebirth in a certain order of devas, thinking: ‘By this virtuous behavior, observance, austerity, or spiritual life I will be a deva or one in the retinue of the devas.’ He relishes this, desires it, and finds satisfaction in it. This, too, is a breach, flaw, blemish, and blotch of the celibate life. He is called one who lives an impure celibate life, one who is fettered by the bond of sexuality. He is not freed from birth, from old age and death, from sorrow, lamentation, pain, dejection, and anguish; he is not freed from suffering, I say.”
(Methuna Sutta, AN. 7.47)
Then venerable Nanda’s monk-friends accosted venerable Nanda with words about a hireling, with words about a lackey, saying: “It seems venerable Nanda is a hireling, it seems venerable Nanda is a lackey, he is living the spiritual life for the sake of celestial nymphs, the Blessed One, it seems, is his surety for gaining five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs!”
(Ud. 3.2)
Re: Seeking rebirth in Tushita heaven
Bhante, It seems you are of the opinion that practitioners (lay or ordained) should only seek human rebirth until stream entry is achieved?