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Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm
by Alino
Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:06 pm
by Sam Vara
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?
No.

Or if there is, I haven't encountered it. And if there were, someone would have sold it to Jeff Bezos or somesuch, and he would have destroyed it.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 5:09 pm
by SDC
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?
Go work at Walt Disney World lol

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:06 pm
by Alino
Sam Vara wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:06 pm No.

Or if there is, I haven't encountered it. And if there were, someone would have sold it to Jeff Bezos or somesuch, and he would have destroyed it.
Good evening Sam Vara πŸ™πŸ˜Š

Its interesting how these questions point out to the unsatisfactory nature of senses, to the truth that there is no possibility to be satisfied by the sense stimulation, and there is no possibility to realise happiness through them...

As Venerable Ajahn Jayasaro said: it's like a man who eat chilli papers hoping that there is one that will be sweet...

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:12 pm
by Mahabrahma
My input on this is the Buddha's Voice.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:13 pm
by Sam Vara
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:06 pm
Sam Vara wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 4:06 pm No.

Or if there is, I haven't encountered it. And if there were, someone would have sold it to Jeff Bezos or somesuch, and he would have destroyed it.
Good evening Sam Vara πŸ™πŸ˜Š

Its interesting how these questions point out to the unsatisfactory nature of senses, to the truth that there is no possibility to be satisfied by the sense stimulation, and there is no possibility to realise happiness through them...

As Venerable Ajahn Jayasaro said: it's like a man who eat chilli papers hoping that there is one that will be sweet...
I think that's absolutely right. I think the only permanent happiness is found through giving up craving for them. :anjali: :heart:

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 6:54 am
by SteRo
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?
Yes. The pleasant form, sound, odour, taste, touch, thought that has been fully understood as impermanent, miserable and not self fulfills all future needs in pleasant form, sound, odour, taste, touch, thought.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:39 am
by pegembara
Neurotransmitters always get depleted and have to be replenished. There is no such thing as an endless supply of dopamine or oxytocin. That is the biological law. So no such thing as endless pleasure. All you have are waves that come and go.

Try going from a bright room to a dark one and vice versa. Is the light or darkness permanent?
So why should pleasurable sensations be any different? Addiction occurs when you need to keep increasing the stimulation just
to maintain the pleasure.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:13 am
by Sam Vara
pegembara wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:39 am Neurotransmitters always get depleted and have to be replenished. There is no such thing as an endless supply of dopamine or oxytocin. That is the biological law. So no such thing as endless pleasure. All you have are waves that come and go.

Try going from a bright room to a dark one and vice versa. Is the light or darkness permanent?
So why should pleasurable sensations be any different? Addiction occurs when you need to keep increasing the stimulation just
to maintain the pleasure.
Thanks, pegembara, that makes a lot of sense. :anjali:

Do you have any understanding of why addiction takes place in some and not others, in terms of the neurotransmitters?

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:37 am
by Crazy cloud
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?
Boredom would be my guess as to where the solution might be. As for sound, is there a more boring sound than the sound of silence?
Touch, odor, taste, and thought are always boring after the initial touch by one of these. The only thing left is boredom.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:15 pm
by Mahabrahma
If you're looking for fulfillment and your purpose in life to be completed, with you entirely satiated in every possible way, look no further than Nibbana and Buddhahood. You won't have to search for stimulation or pleasure seeking any more after that. :anjali:

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:11 am
by pegembara
Sam Vara wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:13 am
pegembara wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:39 am Neurotransmitters always get depleted and have to be replenished. There is no such thing as an endless supply of dopamine or oxytocin. That is the biological law. So no such thing as endless pleasure. All you have are waves that come and go.

Try going from a bright room to a dark one and vice versa. Is the light or darkness permanent?
So why should pleasurable sensations be any different? Addiction occurs when you need to keep increasing the stimulation just
to maintain the pleasure.
Thanks, pegembara, that makes a lot of sense. :anjali:

Do you have any understanding of why addiction takes place in some and not others, in terms of the neurotransmitters?
For addictive chemicals like Oxycontin, the problem is you need to keep taking them just to remain normal. That is when you have become chemically dependent on them. Hard drugs like heroin or ICE works like this. Stopping them suddenly can cause a withdrawal reaction that may be life-threatening.

So it isn't just a matter of will power that can stop the addiction.

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:10 am
by Sam Vara
pegembara wrote: ↑Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:11 am
For addictive chemicals like Oxycontin, the problem is you need to keep taking them just to remain normal. That is when you have become chemically dependent on them. Hard drugs like heroin or ICE works like this. Stopping them suddenly can cause a withdrawal reaction that may be life-threatening.

So it isn't just a matter of will power that can stop the addiction.
Thanks! :anjali:

Re: Ultimate stimulation ?

Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:16 am
by SarathW
Alino wrote: ↑Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:59 pm Dear friends,

Investigating senses the questions arose :

Is there any form that once have been seen can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant forms?

Is there any sound that once have been heard can fully and permanently fulfill all future needs in pleasant sounds?

...odour, taste, touch, thought...?

What are yours reflections and observations ?
Buddha said that all the feelings have three characteristics of pleasant, unpleasant, and neutral.
However, they all are impermanent.
Nibbana is the only permanent state.