Rightly Self Awakened

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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ddeck
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Rightly Self Awakened

Post by ddeck »

Perhaps this question is not conducive to the practice, but I am somewhat curious about the implications it might have on the nature of the Dhamma and how it is discovered.

Buddhas are said to be "rightly self awakened" having forged the path to nibbana by their own accord. With that being said, Gautama Buddha was an ordained follower of Kassapa Buddha in a previous lifetime. Given that before attaining nibbana the buddha saw an unfathomable number of his past lives, is it not the case that Gautama Buddha re-discovered the dhamma this way? I'm wondering if there has been any discourse on this topic. Thank you!
dharmacorps
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by dharmacorps »

Yup, this is explained in the suttas as being the case.

"So I too found the ancient path, the ancient trail, traveled by the Awakened Ones of old." — SN 12.65
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cappuccino
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by cappuccino »

Buddha wrote:Once, monks, there was a teacher named Araka, a sectarian leader who was free of passion for sensual pleasures. He had many hundreds of students and he taught them the Dhamma in this way:
Arakenanusasani Sutta: Araka's Teaching
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ddeck
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by ddeck »

Also regarding that sutta, I’m curious as to how we should interpret the teaching that humans lived for 60,000 years. Stuff like that leads me to more doubt in my practice
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mikenz66
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by mikenz66 »

Hi ddeck,
ddeck wrote: Fri Sep 10, 2021 10:56 pm Also regarding that sutta, I’m curious as to how we should interpret the teaching that humans lived for 60,000 years. Stuff like that leads me to more doubt in my practice
It's certainly somewhat of a puzzle how to hold suttas such as that, and this one: AN7.66 The Seven Suns https://suttacentral.net/an7.66/en/sujato, ["A rare discourse on cosmic evolution. The Buddha describes the successive appearance of seven suns and how even the earth will be burned up."] against the very "rational" suttas about suffering, senses, mind states, and so on. Bhikkhu Sujato gave a series of talks a couple of years ago about Buddhist Mythology, which may be of interest:


Ajahn Sujato - Buddhist Mythology: The Sacred and the Profane - Part 1 of 4.
Part 1 - May 21st, 2019 - The Buddhist tradition has created and passed down the world’s oldest and largest body of mythological literature, yet its value is rarely appreciated. Mythology creates meaning by situating a people in the story of the world. Buddhist mythology teaches us how Buddhist people over the years have struggled to reconcile the pure and exalted teachings of the Buddha with their messy and imperfect lives. These are the stories that don’t make it into the “proper” doctrines: stories of women, of loss, of the dispossessed, of redemption in the most unlikely places. This course draws on multiple modern interpretations of myth to illuminate Buddhist stories, arguing that mythology deserves a central place in our understanding of how we, as people inspired by the Buddha’s teachings, can learn from those who have come before.
See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhist_mythology

:heart:
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DooDoot
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by DooDoot »

The Mahāpadānasutta says that the Buddha Kassapa was a brahmin of Benares, way back in the days when the humans of Jambudīpa had a lifespan of 20,000 years. And so…

Did Buddha Kassapa live on a different planet?

Who knows? Perhaps Benares is a misspelling of Benetnash. :)
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by DooDoot »

mikenz66 wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:14 am It's certainly somewhat of a puzzle...
MN 81 contains the phrase “ahaṃ tena samayena” ("I myself was... at that time"), which appears found 5 times in the suttas, at least 22 times in the Buddhavaṃsa, twice in the Therāpadāna and once is the Therīapadāna. The phrase predominates in the later texts of the KN. Possibly u can consider asking the Master Sujato's view about this. :)
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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ddeck
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by ddeck »

DooDoot wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:54 am Did Buddha Kassapa live on a different planet?

Who knows? Perhaps Benares is a misspelling of Benetnash. :)
I considered this as well but Mn 81 talks about the Buddha stopping in a specific location and recollected that it was where Kassapa Buddha lived and taught. It also says that Kassapa was a teacher to one of the kings of Kashi which was only 100 or so years older than Gautama Buddha so I'm not sure what to make of that
2600htz
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by 2600htz »

Hi:

No, the Buddha did not re-discovered dhamma that way. Recollection of past lifes before the Buddhas awakening took place during the "first watch of the night". Thats not such a long period to be able to recollect in much detail each lifetime.

Regards.
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Re: Rightly Self Awakened

Post by DooDoot »

ddeck wrote: Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:49 pm
DooDoot wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:54 am Did Buddha Kassapa live on a different planet?

Who knows? Perhaps Benares is a misspelling of Benetnash. :)
I considered this as well but Mn 81 talks about the Buddha stopping in a specific location and recollected that it was where Kassapa Buddha lived and taught. It also says that Kassapa was a teacher to one of the kings of Kashi which was only 100 or so years older than Gautama Buddha so I'm not sure what to make of that
What i posted was merely a direct quote of our Venerable Dhammanando. I trust we will find those rare suttas that refer to past times have the same type of society, cities, technology, etc, as norther India had 2,600 years ago. Past Buddha and literal past life suttas are very rare and obviously represent a certain genre of suttas sharing the characteristics of later texts. Best wishes :smile:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
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