"The Buddha via the Bible"

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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DooDoot
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

Post by DooDoot »

un8- wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:00 am What's unique to the Buddha Dhamma is Supermundane Right View

And then Paṭiccasamuppāda itself has several interpretations like three life model vs one life, etc..
The above sounds illogical because Paṭiccasamuppāda is Supramundane. :mrgreen:
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DooDoot
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

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un8- wrote: Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:48 amNow you state they're not attracted to food.
Whoops i meant "non-returner" is not attracted to food. Therefore, attraction to food would be the most subtle sensual craving of a once-again-returner; particularly given it is related to the most basic life need.
un8- wrote: Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:48 am them being not attracted to food has nothing to do with sex.
Food & sex can both be sensual pleasures.
un8- wrote: Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:48 amOverall, seems like you're making things up which are not supported by any sutta. But alas, you can't reason with a cafeteria buddhist who picks and chooses mango ice cream over sex and claims to be a once returner.
Again, more verbal nonsense. Five precepts thanks. :thanks:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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dharmacorps
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

Post by dharmacorps »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:15 pm For example, i personally have no idea about who German Romantics, American Transcendentalists & Ralph Waldo Emerson are.
It would be good to learn a bit about them then, so you can understand the basis for Thanissaro Bhikkhu's argument.
Kjigme
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

Post by Kjigme »

I am watching on youtube a talk on "Rebirth in Early Buddhism & current research" with Bhikkhu Analāyo. There is a moment where he says something similar to what Bhikkhu Thanissaro said in his article. It is related to the belief in rebirth : "...it is a basic tendency in western buddhism that has its roots in protestant buddhism in past colonial history and it's based on universalization of subjectivity: i like this therefore this must be what the buddha thought..." This was a part of the talk where the speaker mentions the disbelief in rebirth in western buddhism.
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Buddha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Dhamma, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Sangha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!

Ratana Sutta
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DooDoot
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

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Kjigme wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:52 am I am watching on youtube a talk on "Rebirth in Early Buddhism & current research" with Bhikkhu Analāyo. There is a moment where he says something similar to what Bhikkhu Thanissaro said in his article. It is related to the belief in rebirth : "...it is a basic tendency in western buddhism that has its roots in protestant buddhism in past colonial history and it's based on universalization of subjectivity: i like this therefore this must be what the buddha thought..." This was a part of the talk where the speaker mentions the disbelief in rebirth in western buddhism.
But many probably most Western Buddhists, similar to Thanissaro and Analayo, believe in rebirth. Therefore, it appears Thanissaro and Analayo's views are self-contradictory.

Also, keep in mind, Protestant Christians generally believe in an after-life. Therefore, again, it appears Thanissaro and Analayo's views are self-contradictory.

You should also consider that in his PDF called 'Shape of Suffering', Thanissaro himself says "jati" does not mean "rebirth" but, instead, means "identity". Therefore, again, it appears Thanissaro views are self-contradictory.

You should ask yourself why do monks such as Thanissaro and Analayo write scores of very long books that are controversial & censured by other Buddhists ? Have these monks ever developed a real mediation practise? Probably not.

:alien: :alien: :spy:
Last edited by DooDoot on Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:25 am, edited 5 times in total.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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Kjigme
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

Post by Kjigme »

DooDoot wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:11 am
Kjigme wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:52 am I am watching on youtube a talk on "Rebirth in Early Buddhism & current research" with Bhikkhu Analāyo. There is a moment where he says something similar to what Bhikkhu Thanissaro said in his article. It is related to the belief in rebirth : "...it is a basic tendency in western buddhism that has its roots in protestant buddhism in past colonial history and it's based on universalization of subjectivity: i like this therefore this must be what the buddha thought..." This was a part of the talk where the speaker mentions the disbelief in rebirth in western buddhism.
But many probably most Western Buddhists, similar to Thanissaro and Analayo, believe in rebirth. Therefore, it appears Thanissaro and Analayo's views are self-contradictory.

Also, keep in mind, Protestant Christians generally believe in an after-life. Therefore, again, it appears Thanissaro and Analayo's views are self-contradictory.

You should also consider that in his PDF called 'Shape of Suffering', Thanissaro himself says "jati" does not mean "rebirth" but, instead, means "identity". Therefore, again, it appears Thanissaro views are self-contradictory.

You should ask yourself why do monks such as Thanissaro and Analayo write scores of very long books that are controversial & censured by other Buddhists ? Have these monks ever developed a real mediation practise? Probably not.

:alien: :alien: :spy:
It all depends on context! anyway... thanks for your input :namaste:
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Buddha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Dhamma, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Sangha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!

Ratana Sutta
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DooDoot
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

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Kjigme wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:22 am It all depends on context! anyway... thanks for your input
The Buddha taught two types of dhamma (MN 117), namely:

1. Core supramundane dhamma for liberation

2. Worldly dhamma for merit making or morality.

The core supramundane dhamma is realised in the here & now.

It is OK to believe in the worldly dhamma but, according to the Ani Sutta, it is really not OK to undermine/subvert the core dhamma.

Best wishes :)
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
Kjigme
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Re: "The Buddha via the Bible"

Post by Kjigme »

DooDoot wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:12 am
Kjigme wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:22 am It all depends on context! anyway... thanks for your input
The Buddha taught two types of dhamma (MN 117), namely:

1. Core supramundane dhamma for liberation

2. Worldly dhamma for merit making or morality.

The core supramundane dhamma is realised in the here & now.

It is OK to believe in the worldly dhamma but, according to the Ani Sutta, it is really not OK to undermine/subvert the core dhamma.

Best wishes :)
It's like the Mahayana view when it to refers to relative and supreme truth. I now understand what you are referring to. I am actually listening to a conversation with Dhammarato in which he mentions that it is dangerous to teach the supramundane dhamma to some people. Worldly dhamma is important to understand and practice. Rebirth is a relative truth. For those who haven't actualized the supramundane dhamma rebirth is a "fact". What do you think?
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Buddha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Dhamma, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!
We beings here assembled, whether terrestrial or celestial, salute the Accomplished Sangha, honoured by gods and men. May there be happiness!

Ratana Sutta
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