Abandon

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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DarwidHalim
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Abandon

Post by DarwidHalim »

What does this word mean to you?

Do you think abandon is the solution of your problem?
I am not here nor there.
I am not right nor wrong.
I do not exist neither non-exist.
I am not I nor non-I.
I am not in samsara nor nirvana.
To All Buddhas, I bow down for the teaching of emptiness. Thank You!
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Sam Vara
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Re: Abandon

Post by Sam Vara »

1)
What does this word mean to you?
Well, here is what Ajahn Chah says about it:
What the Buddha saw was that you must abandon both the past and the future. When we say abandon it doesn't mean you literally get rid of them. Abandoning means the focus of your mindfulness and insight is right here at this one point - the present moment. The past and the future link together right here. The present is both the result of the past and the cause of what lies ahead in the future. So you must completely abandon both cause and result, and simply abide with the present moment. We say abandon them, but these are just words used to describe the way of training the mind. Even though you let go of your attachment and abandon the past and future, the natural process of cause and effect remains in place. In fact, you could call this the halfway point; it's already part of the process of cause and result. The Buddha taught to watch the present moment where you will see a continuous process of arising and passing away, followed by more arising and passing away.
2)
Do you think abandon is the solution of your problem?
Which problem would that be?

Abandoning my family would not be much of a solution. Abandoning some bad habits would be nice.
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Eccedustin
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Re: Abandon

Post by Eccedustin »

Remember that the Buddha abandoned his family, his wealth, his friends and even his baby son in order to go out and pursue his quest. The Buddha did this because these things held him back. They were attachments. Later, however, Both his son and wife became followers and were part of the Sangha. Even his horse, which died of despair after he left it, was said to have been reincarnated and became a follower of the dhamma.

We should abandon what holds us back from enlightenment. This is the point. If your family is holding you back from reaching your goals, you must part ways with them or find a way to fix things. Abandonment can mean to abandon any negative influences people in your life have on you, without necessarily abandoning them personally.

Abandonment is also about leaving behind childish thoughts, attachments, desires, etc.
The universe is awake, conscious and aware of itself! The universe is awake, conscious and aware of itself because we are awake, conscious and aware of ourselves. We are the not just in the universe, we are the universe.
Nyana
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Re: Abandon

Post by Nyana »

DarwidHalim wrote:What does this word mean to you?
Pajahati: to give up, renounce, forsake, abandon, eliminate, let go, get rid of.

Pahāna: giving up, leaving, abandoning, rejection.

As an aspect of right effort, pahāna is an integral aspect of the noble eightfold path. SN 45.8 Vibhaṅga Sutta:
  • He generates desire, makes an effort, arouses energy, applies his mind, and strives for the abandoning of worthless unskillful qualities that have arisen.
And the exertion of abandoning (pahānappadhāna) is one of the four right exertions. AN 4.14 Saṃvara Sutta:
  • And what, monks, is the exertion of abandoning? Here monks, a monk does not give in to a thought of sensual pleasure that has arisen. He abandons it, destroys it, dispels it, brings about the utter cessation of its existence. He does not give in to a thought of aversion... a thought of violence... any worthless, unskillful qualities that have arisen. He abandons them, destroys them, dispels them, brings about the utter cessation of their existence. This, monks, is called the exertion of abandoning.
DarwidHalim wrote:Do you think abandon is the solution of your problem?
The Buddha seems to think so. SN 35.101 Na Tumhaka Sutta:
  • Whatever is not yours, abandon it. Your abandoning it will be for your long-term happiness and benefit. And what is not yours?

    The eye is not yours, abandon it. Your abandoning it will be for your long-term happiness and benefit. Forms are not yours... Eye-consciousness is not yours... Eye-contact is not yours... Whatever arises in dependence on eye-contact, experienced either as pleasure, as pain, or as neither-pleasure-nor-pain, that too is not yours, so abandon it. Your abandoning it will be for your long-term happiness and benefit.

    The ear is not yours, abandon it...
    The nose is not yours, abandon it...
    The tongue is not yours, abandon it...
    The body is not yours, abandon it...

    The mind is not yours, abandon it. Your abandoning it will be for your long-term happiness and benefit. Mental phenomena are not yours... Mental-consciousness is not yours... Mind-contact is not yours... Whatever arises in dependence on mind-contact, experienced either as pleasure, as pain, or as neither-pleasure-nor-pain, that too is not yours, so abandon it. Your abandoning it will be for your long-term happiness and benefit.
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ground
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Re: Abandon

Post by ground »

DarwidHalim wrote:Do you think abandon is the solution of your problem?
What problem?

Kind regards
vinasp
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Re: Abandon

Post by vinasp »

Hi everyone,

Here are some of the Pali words that can mean abandon(ment):

abandon : (v.t.) cajati; jahāti; pajahati; vijahati; vajjeti. (pp.) catta; jahita; pajahita; vijahita; vajjita.

abandonment : (nt.) cajana; pahāna; vijahana; vajjana.

From: English-Pali Dictionary - Link:

http://www.budsas.org/ebud/dict-ep/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regards, Vincent.
vinasp
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Re: Abandon

Post by vinasp »

Hi everyone,

Perhaps the most important use of "abandon" is found in the Third Noble
Truth, in connection with craving.

idaṃ kho pana, bhikkhave, dukkhanirodhaṃ ariyasaccaṃ — yo tassāyeva taṇhāya asesavirāganirodho cāgo paṭinissaggo mutti anālayo.

"Monks, what is the Noble Truth of the Cessation of Suffering? It is the
complete, remainderless fading away and cessation of that hunger, that
craving, its forsaking and giving up; the relinquishing, letting go,
release and abandoning of that same craving."

There are two methods of abandoning:

1. Abandoning by insight or seeing which by removing ignorance or
misconceptions brings about the cessation of those unwholesome states
which had arisen in dependence on those misconceptions.

2. Abandoning by effort. This brings about a gradual diminishing of
unwholesome states by working directly on the habits themselves. For
example, craving is suppressed instead of being welcomed and delighted in.
I call this - liberation by disenchantment.

Regards, Vincent.
vinasp
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Re: Abandon

Post by vinasp »

Hi everyone,

The three (or four) principle asava's are abandoned by seeing, as explained
in MN 2.5

♦ 17. “katame ca, bhikkhave, āsavā dassanā pahātabbā?

"What taints (asava's), bhikkhus, should be abandoned by seeing?"

PED entry for pahana:

Pahāna (nt.) [fr. pa+hā, see pajahati] giving up, leaving, abandoning, rejection M i.60, iii.4, 72; S i.13, 132 (dukkha˚); ii.170; iii.53; iv.7 sq.; D iii.225, 246 A i.82, 134; ii.26, 232 (kaṇhassa kammassa ˚āya). iii.431; Sn 374, 1106 (=vūpasama paṭinissagga etc Nd2 429); Dh 331; J i.79; Ps i.26; ii.98, 156; Pug 16 Dhs 165, 174, 339; Nett 15 sq., 24, 192; Vism 194 (nīvaraṇa -- santāpa˚); DhsA 166, 345; VvA 73. -- ˚pariññā see pariññā; -- ˚vinaya avoidance consisting in giving up (coupled with saŋvara -- vinaya avoidance by protection, prophylaxis), based on the 5 qualities tadanga -- pahāna, vikkhambhana˚, samuccheda˚, paṭippassaddhi˚ nissaraṇa˚ DhsA 351; SnA 8.[End Quote]

The other kinds of taints are abandoned by restraining, using, enduring,
avoiding, removing and developing, see MN 2.4

Section MN 2.11 explains how the first three fetters are abandoned by wise
attention to the Four Noble Truths. It is possible to interpret these three
fetters as representing the fourth asava, the asava of views.

tassa evaṃ yoniso manasikaroto tīṇi saṃyojanāni pahīyanti — sakkāyadiṭṭhi, vicikicchā, sīlabbataparāmāso. ime vuccanti, bhikkhave, āsavā dassanā pahātabbā.

"When he attends wisely in this way, three fetters are abandoned in him;
personality view, doubt, and adherence to rules and observances. These are
called the taints that should be abandoned by seeing."[Bodhi, 1995]

The last sentence marks the end of this section about the taints which are
abandoned by seeing. So these three fetters are included in the asava's which
are abandoned by seeing.

The word used for "abandoned" in connection with the fetters is "pahiyanti":

Pahīyati [Pass. of pajahati] to be abandoned, to pass away, vanish M i.7; S i.219 (fut. ˚issati); ii.196 (ppr ˚īyamāna); v.152; Sn 806; Nd1 124; VbhA 271. Spelt pahiyyati at S v.150.[PED - End Quote]

MN 2 ATI version: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regards, Vincent.
vinasp
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Re: Abandon

Post by vinasp »

Hi everyone,

One can abandon external things, for example, certain people, a particular
dwelling, a certain location or material possessions. All these things
continue to exist after being abandoned.

But one can also abandon psychological things. Do these continue to exist
after they have been abandoned?

Consider SN 35.101 - what are we instructed to abandon?

The eye, visible forms, eye consciousness, eye contact and whatever arises
in dependence on eye-contact. And the same for the ear, nose, tongue, body
and mind.

These are the same things which are said to be impermanent, suffering and
nonself. Each should be seen as it really is with correct wisdom thus:
'This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self.'[ SN 35.1 to 35.6]

"SEEING THUS, bhikkhus, the instructed noble disciple experiences revulsion
towards the [eye]. Experiencing revulsion he becomes dispassionate. Through
dispassion his mind is liberated. ..."

Replace [eye] with: [ear], [nose], [tongue], [body], [mind]:[forms], [sounds],
[odours], [tastes], [tactile objects] and [mental phenomena].

[Bhikkhu Bodhi, Connected Discourses, pages 1133-1135, SN 35.1 to 35.6]

So all these things are abandoned BY SEEING with wisdom: 'This is not
mine, this I am not, this is not my self.'

Elsewhere, it is said that seeing these things as impermanent will result
in liberation.

Does the "eye" cease when it is abandoned?

If the "eye" is understood in a literal way, then, no. But if we take "eye"
as meaning the eye regarded with ignorance as: 'This is mine, this I am, this
is my self,' then that "eye" does indeed cease.

Regards, Vincent.
pegembara
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Re: Abandon

Post by pegembara »

What does this word mean to you?

Do you think abandon is the solution of your problem?

Understand the problem and you will learn to abandon.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.
pegembara
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Re: Abandon

Post by pegembara »

Eccedustin wrote:Remember that the Buddha abandoned his family, his wealth, his friends and even his baby son in order to go out and pursue his quest. The Buddha did this because these things held him back. They were attachments. Later, however, Both his son and wife became followers and were part of the Sangha. Even his horse, which died of despair after he left it, was said to have been reincarnated and became a follower of the dhamma.

We should abandon what holds us back from enlightenment. This is the point. If your family is holding you back from reaching your goals, you must part ways with them or find a way to fix things. Abandonment can mean to abandon any negative influences people in your life have on you, without necessarily abandoning them personally.

Abandonment is also about leaving behind childish thoughts, attachments, desires, etc.
When the Boddhisatta abandoned his family this was mundane abandonment.
After his enlightenment the abandonment was supramundane. It was a relinquishment rather than a getting rid of thing.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.
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