Depression and Meditation

[Feathers]

Starting a thread to develop on Martin's suggestion here.

As a fair few people on this board seem to suffer depression, and even more of us probably know someone who does, I would like to make this a thread to exchange suggestions for ways to treat depression: what type of meditation has (or hasn't) helped, other techniques, tips etc. I would like if possible to keep it quite practical - if we can avoid endless discussion of 'what is a feeling' / 'who is feeling this' etc. that would be nice . . .

Also, if people participating can remember that a some people in the discussion may be currently suffering with depression, and choose their words and manners accordingly, that would be considerate.

Lastly: if you're reading this, think you have depression, and haven't yet sought professional, please please do so. This thread is for support and tips, not to replace the (very necessary) professional treatment.

Useful Links and Resources

I'm going to keep updating this as I go, and as the thread goes.

Meditation / Buddhist
Wildmind - Meditation and Depression - very useful. Thanks to Spiny Norman for this one

Medical
Crazy Meds - brilliant resource on all things pharmaceutical

NHS depression resources and info

Funny (because if you don't laugh . . .)
Hyperbole and a Half - a very witty blog that includes a couple of fantastic posts on depression. Might be especially useful for explaining it to non-sufferers

[Spiny Norman]

Some interesting material here: http://www.wildmind.org/applied/depression

[martinfrank]

In other threads several members mentioned their experience with depression. Feathers and others suggested we make a thread about Depression and Meditation.

Some posters suggested that depression is a chemical imbalance best cured with medications, others suggested that a little or a lot of meditation will do the job.

My experience is sort of both: I took and take the usual medications and I feel that they help me not to fall into abysses of sadness and despair. Before I took the medications I would start crying in the middle of a shopping center without any apparent reason, just feeling terribly sad. Medication cured that nicely.

I also stayed in a monastery and meditated several hours a day and this gave me a break that I could go without medication for several months.

What is your experience? What works/worked for you? Which kind of meditation works best for you? What activities do you find helpful/not helpful?

I add a list of things which I found helpful / not helpful:

Helpful (I will edit this list)
Easy meditation like 5-12 minutes of apanasati
Maté (the herbal tea from Argentina)
Dark chocolate in small quantities
Green tea
Sleep early/rise early (I manage to sleep early, about the rising early we'll talk after I get up)
Sunlight and light therapy
Warmth
Acupuncture
Perilla Oil
"customized" Vitamins
Eating light
Bringing up a kid
Having a dog (somebody is happy when you come home)
Learning/playing a musical instrument
Expecting less from oneself. Do only 1-3 things in the morning, another 1-3 things in the afternoon... I mean office work, not open and close one eye, open and close the other eye, repeat the exercise!

Not helpful (I will edit this list)
Alcohol
Smoking
Drugs (like hashish, marijuana, heroin, cocaine, ecstasy and other "party-drugs"
Eating parts of killed animals
Sugar, particularly white sugar
Peanuts
Pointless Internet surfing
Heated discussion (including web discussion)
Sex
Sleeping late
Low voltage bulbs, cloudy sky, Scandinavian winters
Ambitious goals, long ToDO lists.
Watching TV
News beyond what you can get from the CNB or Reuters headlines.

[thepea]

If you state that drugs(medications) are helpful, then you should clarify what drugs are not helpful. It may be a little confusing for some. It may also be helpful to discuss the active ingredients in what you are calling medication vs. the active ingredients of what you classify as drugs. There may be some links to specific foods one could avoid or get more of.

Hot water bottles, exposure to sunlight(vitamin d) raise the spirits.

"Bringing up a kid" only if they tasted good going down. Humour can also be helpful.

[martinfrank]

Thank you for pointing out that "drugs" has different meanings in different locations.

I am not a psychiatrist. I know which prescription medications work(ed) for me. An experienced psychiatrist will know much better what "drugs" work best for which patient.

You are right about sunlight. Kindly send some to Zurich, Switzerland. It is now 13° and raining.

English is not my first language. The good thing about kids and animals is that they disturb you which keeps you from spending hours on the same thoughts. If you have an attack of major depression, the responsibility may be too much for you.

What foods do you recommend / not recommend?

Hot water bottles? How to use them?

Humour is a good idea too... you mean like Robin Williams?

[Spiny Norman]

You are right about sunlight. Kindly send some to Zurich, Switzerland. It is now 13° and raining.

It's not much better here in the UK.

[thepea]

You are right about sunlight. Kindly send some to Zurich, Switzerland. It is now 13° and raining.

Done, it should be there Thursday.

The good thing about kids and animals is that they disturb you which keeps you from spending hours on the same thoughts. If you have an attack of major depression, the responsibility may be too much for you.

I feel we should do with less, and allow animals to live amongst their own kind, and not be forced to live with unhappy people. I work in many peoples homes and see to many animals ignored and mistreated because of their owners mental disease. Not to say some animals and some people are not a great fit, but I do not wish to encourage those feeling down to rush out and get a pet to raise their spirits.

What foods do you not recommend?

Eggs, meat and dairy?

Hot water bottles? How to use them?

Fill a bottle with hot/warm water and place on the area of discomfort. Feeling anxious place on the chest, it should distract you from the discomfort and help to raise your spirits.

Humour is a good idea too... you mean like Robin Williams?

Yes, if you find his comedy funny.

[Feathers]

Hiya, I started a thread in the wellness and fitness section - mind if I copy over your original post . . . or could mods merge the two threads (don't mind which section they end up in)

Edit to add: here's the thread I started: http://www.dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=21580

[martinfrank]

You are right about sunlight. Kindly send some to Zurich, Switzerland. It is now 13° and raining.

Done, it should be there Thursday.

The good thing about kids and animals is that they disturb you which keeps you from spending hours on the same thoughts. If you have an attack of major depression, the responsibility may be too much for you.

I feel we should do with less, and allow animals to live amongst their own kind, and not be forced to live with unhappy people. I work in many peoples homes and see to many animals ignored and mistreated because of their owners mental disease. Not to say some animals and some people are not a great fit, but I do not wish to encourage those feeling down to rush out and get a pet to raise their spirits.

I agree with you. A dog is not a medication (and a child is not a marriage repair kit).

[martinfrank]

Dear Feathers

I apologize. I didn't see your thread. Should we combine them? I agree but I don't know how to do it. I will study your links.

(In the office... should start working)

Thanks and greetings

Martin

[tiltbillings]

Merged. Now do you want this in "Open Dhamma" or in the "Wellness?"

[martinfrank]

Merged. Now do you want this in "Open Dhamma" or in the "Wellness?"

Thanks, Ben, to me Open Dhamma seems better but if Feathers or somebody else prefers Wellness that's well for me too. Martin

[Feathers]

I don't mind

[ancientbuddhism]

I have had to deal with ‘depression’ for many years. I had tried some prescribed medications, but these only left me with side-effects or other issues.

What turned out to be effective for me over a decade ago was a strengthened effort in meditation practice. Insight practices, guided by the classical ānāpānasati and satipaṭṭhāna models which lend emphasis on calm and insight working together, gave me the ability to parse out the experience of physical ‘depressive’ conditions from mental habits seeking commentary to meet these.

What I had noticed through ‘sitting with’ depression, is that there is the physical and sensate experience of depression (which martinfrank gave helpful advise on how to manage here), and then there is the narrative, conceptually driven mental habits that spin one out of control. When experienced through practice in this way, the nature of narrative and emotional based phenomena are seen as ephemeral and fall away. Whereby the physical states, although may still be present and run its natural course, is manageable.

A couple of helpful sutta resources:

The Discourse on the Dart – Salla Sutta

Discourse on Agitation with Taking-up – Upādāparitassanā Sutta

[Mkoll]

What I had noticed through ‘sitting with’ depression, is that there is the physical and sensate experience of depression (which martinfrank gave helpful advise on how to manage here), and then there is the narrative, conceptually driven mental habits that spin one out of control. When experienced through practice in this way, the nature of narrative and emotional based phenomena are seen as ephemeral and fall away. Whereby the physical states, although may still be present and run its natural course, is manageable.

I think that's a good way of describing it. I struggled with depression as a teenager and I remember it was the emotional stories I made up about myself that really led to the most suffering and closest to an actual contemplation of suicide.

I'd also agree that a diligent meditation practice is the most effective way to deal with depression.