A Buddhist discussion forum on the Dhamma of Theravāda Buddhism
https://www.dhammawheel.com/
Hello,
And yet we find eternalist type views in forest traditions:tharpa wrote: ↑Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:38 amAbsolutely not. Such a view is sometimes found in fringe Mahayana sects though, such as the Nichiren.Santi253 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:02 pmThis is something I don't know a whole lot about. Does the typical Theravada Buddhist, in traditionally Theravadin countries, believe that the Buddha remains present in the world?David N. Snyder wrote: True, but Mun is more of an outlier, not a typical, mainstream theravada view.
But to give the Buddha's teachings on this: The Buddha was asked thousands of questions during his 45 years of teaching. There were a very, very few he declined to answer. One of the ones he declined to answer was, "Does an arahant exist after death, or not exist after death?"
Please note that a Buddha is one of the three kinds of arahants.
And see also:Sabbe_Dhamma_Anatta wrote: ↑Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:43 pm It'd be a good idea to save this file Ajahn Martin , in case of probable future deletion, similar to the fate of "some links" mentioned in the pdf.
Ajahn Martin --->Consciousness or vinnana is one of the khandhas and of course is not eternal. The citta is eternal. Just remember what the Lord Buddha said, the Thatagata after dead neither is nor is not. The citta is not individualistic, not personal. How could the Lord Buddha talk to Acharn Mun presenting Dhamma to him in the form of the Lord Buddha, if there is nothing that is eternal and everything dies away? We grasp the term citta wrongly, we think every beeing has a citta, no that is not right, every being is part of that one citta, that is eternal. This would be the correct view.
Here at DW in our very small sample size, we see about an even split in views, but would the poll results be much more skewed toward eternalism among Buddhists in Buddhist countries; i.e. more of the born-Buddhist adherents as opposed to mostly convert Buddhists on english-language Buddhist forums?Dhammanando wrote: ↑Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:40 pmI think "common" would be a bit of an understatement. The primordial citta conception and similar strains of thinly disguised soul theory and semi-eternalism are ubiquitous in these traditions.Mkoll wrote:In your experience, is this concept of a primordial citta common in the Ajahn Mun and Chah forest traditions?
In the same way, a cruel individual extinguishes it by not being cruel. An individual who kills extinguishes it by not killing. …
Evameva kho, cunda, vihiṃsakassa purisapuggalassa avihiṃsā hoti parinibbānāya, pāṇātipātissa purisapuggalassa pāṇātipātā veramaṇī hoti parinibbānāya
https://suttacentral.net/mn8/en/sujato
‘The Blessed One is awakened, tamed, serene, crossed over, and extinguished. And he teaches Dhamma for awakening, taming, serenity, crossing over, and extinguishment.’
buddho so bhagavā bodhāya dhammaṃ deseti, danto so bhagavā damathāya dhammaṃ deseti, santo so bhagavā samathāya dhammaṃ deseti, tiṇṇo so bhagavā taraṇāya dhammaṃ deseti, parinibbuto so bhagavā parinibbānāya dhammaṃ desetī
https://suttacentral.net/mn35/en/sujato
Not grasping, they’re not anxious. Not being anxious, they personally become extinguished.
Anupādiyaṃ na paritassati, aparitassaṃ paccattaññeva parinibbāyati:
https://suttacentral.net/mn37/en/sujato
Venerable sir, what is the cause and reason why some beings here do not attain Nibbāna in this very life? And what is the cause and reason why some beings here attain Nibbāna in this very life?
ko nu kho, bhante, hetu, ko paccayo yena m’idhekacce sattā diṭṭheva dhamme no parinibbāyanti?
There are, lord of the devas, forms cognizable by the eye that are desirable, lovely, agreeable, pleasing, sensually enticing, tantalizing. If a bhikkhu seeks delight in them, welcomes them, and remains holding to them, his consciousness becomes dependent upon them and clings to them. A bhikkhu with clinging does not attain Nibbāna.
Ko pana, bhante, hetu, ko paccayo yena m’idhekacce sattā diṭṭheva dhamme parinibbāyantī
https://suttacentral.net/sn35.118/en/bodhi
This poll doesn't make much sense, since the word "Parinibbana' has the same meaning as the word "Nibbana":
It's often differentiated as:Assaji wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:01 pm Hi DNS,
This poll doesn't make much sense, since the word "Parinibbana' has the same meaning as the word "Nibbana":
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_ ... bbaana.htm
And the word "Nibbana" has several meanings:
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_r/nibbaana.htm
Final Nibbana. No more becoming in the rounds of samsara is what is meant here.Assaji wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:01 pm Hi DNS,
This poll doesn't make much sense, since the word "Parinibbana' has the same meaning as the word "Nibbana":
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_ ... bbaana.htm
And the word "Nibbana" has several meanings:
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_r/nibbaana.htm
Some are born in the human womb,
evildoers in hell,
those on the good course go
to heaven,
while those without effluent:
totally unbound.
— Dhp 126
According to Bhikkhu Bodhi's analysis this is a misreading.DNS wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:13 pmIt's often differentiated as:Assaji wrote: ↑Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:01 pm Hi DNS,
This poll doesn't make much sense, since the word "Parinibbana' has the same meaning as the word "Nibbana":
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_ ... bbaana.htm
And the word "Nibbana" has several meanings:
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/n_r/nibbaana.htm
Nibbana can be obtained while one is alive, with effluents.
Parinibbana is Nibbana without effluents.
There is quite a lot more detail in Bhikkhu Bodhi's note...Bhikkhu Bodhi wrote:
NIBBĀNA, PARINIBBĀNA
As is well known, nibbāna literally means the extinction of a fire. In popular works on Buddhism, nibbāna plain and simple is often taken to signify Nibbāna as experienced in life, parinibbāna Nibbāna attained at death. This is a misinterpretation.
...
The suttas distinguish between two elements of Nibbāna: the Nibbāna element with residue (sa-upādisesa-nibbānadhātu) and the Nibbāna element without residue (anupādisesanibbānadhātu )—the residue (upādisesa) being the compound of the five aggregates produced by prior craving and kamma (It 38–39). The former is the extinction of lust, hatred, and delusion attained by the arahant while alive; the latter is the remainderless cessation of all conditioned existence that occurs with the arahant’s death.
...
