Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by Ceisiwr »

Mahabrahma
Please don't disparage other Buddhists trying to lead you on the right path. You will get to the right place in your life however, however soon or far. Buddhism is about Metta and nothing else. So no matter what, you will go far. You will never let go of the Dhamma if you keep Loving others, however the moment you let your Metta decrease is the moment you will begin letting go of the Buddha, and His Teachings, but be rest assured the Buddha will never Spiritually let go of you. Don't belittle what He has given you though. And those negative emotions you are having are coming from anger you aren't paying attention to. If you address it, it will soothe, and you will Awaken.
I take my Dhamma instruction from the Mahāvihāravāsins thank you. Universal metta does not mean "never criticise" much less "like everyone". I do not like the likes of Muhammad, but I wish them well. Once again, you do not seem to know Dhamma.
"Because of attachment to doctrines one approaches and refutes,
For those unattached, how can they dispute?
Not because self or no-self are said to be true,
He has only shaken off all harmful views."


Duṭṭhaṭṭhaka Sutta
form
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by form »

SarathW wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:37 am
form wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:20 am
SarathW wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 4:56 am
Agree.
Once you realise Noble Eightfold Path, you have enter the Path.
If one sees all the eight factors of the path linked together and can practice it as such, is that supramundane level already?
The practices leading to stream entry are encapsulated in four factors:


Association with people of integrity is a factor for stream-entry.
Listening to the true Dhamma is a factor for stream-entry.
Appropriate attention is a factor for stream-entry.
Practice in accordance with the Dhamma is a factor for stream-entry.
— SN 55.5

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/stu ... tream.html
Association with people with integrity? Or is it ONLY associated with people with integrity?

First one is easy, second one is hard. If it is the second one, most likely stream enterer will fare poorly in their careers.
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DooDoot
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by DooDoot »

SarathW wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:27 am Mind = you = selfview
unteachable :cry: :meditate:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
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Mahabrahma
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by Mahabrahma »

Ceisiwr wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:22 am Mahabrahma
Please don't disparage other Buddhists trying to lead you on the right path. You will get to the right place in your life however, however soon or far. Buddhism is about Metta and nothing else. So no matter what, you will go far. You will never let go of the Dhamma if you keep Loving others, however the moment you let your Metta decrease is the moment you will begin letting go of the Buddha, and His Teachings, but be rest assured the Buddha will never Spiritually let go of you. Don't belittle what He has given you though. And those negative emotions you are having are coming from anger you aren't paying attention to. If you address it, it will soothe, and you will Awaken.
I take my Dhamma instruction from the Mahāvihāravāsins thank you. Universal metta does not mean "never criticise" much less "like everyone". I do not like the likes of Muhammad, but I wish them well. Once again, you do not seem to know Dhamma.
I respect you and I respect that you understand your Buddhism very well. Thank you for taking the time to talk to me and I wish you the best on your Buddhist journey. May you not ever, ever regress from your wisdom and understanding. :candle:
SarathW
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by SarathW »

DooDoot wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:27 am
SarathW wrote: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:27 am Mind = you = selfview
unteachable :cry: :meditate:
Algree. This understanding is mutual.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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dhammacoustic
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by dhammacoustic »

Mahabrahma wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:54 am (...) Also Muhammed deeply respected the Jewish people, He called them as well as Christians "The People of the Book" in the Quran.
for a time i was really interested in sufism, and i've learned a lot about islam.

i understand your good intentions, and that's really nice of you and healthy. but historically, islam was built on identity politics. you might want to read about the umayyad era, and it would be wise to use non-islamic sources.

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are in fact allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is one of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.
https://quran.com/5/51

judging by the hadith (which were compiled two hundred years after the supposed prophet) i personally think muhammad probably never even existed. the word muhammad in arabic literally means "one who is worthy of praise", and it was actually a title for jesus christ, used by the nabatean christians. putting that aside, there are lots of errors in the quran, like moses being jesus' uncle. so it looks like such quranic texts were written mostly based on hearsay, written by people who had no linguistic access to the hebrew bible. it's funny because the quran also acknowledges biblical authority, yet make many false statements about its content.
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by Coëmgenu »

dhammacoustic wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:06 am
Mahabrahma wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:54 am (...) Also Muhammed deeply respected the Jewish people, He called them as well as Christians "The People of the Book" in the Quran.
for a time i was really interested in sufism, and i've learned a lot about islam.

i understand your good intentions, and that's really nice of you and healthy. but historically, islam was built on identity politics. you might want to read about the umayyad era, and it would be wise to use non-islamic sources.

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are in fact allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is one of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.
https://quran.com/5/51

judging by the hadith (which were compiled two hundred years after the supposed prophet) i personally think muhammad probably never even existed. the word muhammad in arabic literally means "one who is worthy of praise", and it was actually a title for jesus christ, used by the nabatean christians. putting that aside, there are lots of errors in the quran, like moses being jesus' uncle. so it looks like such quranic texts were written mostly based on hearsay, written by people who had no linguistic access to the hebrew bible. it's funny because the quran also acknowledges biblical authority, yet make many false statements about its content.
The Christian communities in the areas in which the Quran was being compiled were likely heterodox and likely just-recently exiled from Imperial Christian society. Exiling heretics to that area was a favourite activity of the Byzantines. That is why the Mandaeans no longer live by the Jordan River. The Byzantines in particular didn't exile them, but Greek-Rome learned how to from Rome-Rome which, once Christian, did the same.

The Quran has passages to the effect of, "Do not, Christians, say 'Three In One' and do not worship the trinity of Mary, God, and Jesus" (paraphrase). Now, if you know anything at all about normal Christianity, the trinity does not include Mary.

But the thing is, to some Christians living in the area, it is quite plausible for them to have any manner of heterodoxy concerning Mary and Jesus. Alternatively, Christian Arianism (referring to the stance that Jesus is a created being and is merely lifted to Godhood) had just recently been massive and just experienced a huge setback to the Pauline-Petrine Orthodoxy. Further suggesting that the Quran gets its information regarding Christianity from minority nonstandard Christianities is a passage concerning Jesus's illusory crucifixion that appears to base itself on the earlier Gnostic Apocalypse of Paul.
Then, the monks sang this gāthā:

These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and rots.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?

The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.

(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
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Mahabrahma
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by Mahabrahma »

dhammacoustic wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:06 am
Mahabrahma wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:54 am (...) Also Muhammed deeply respected the Jewish people, He called them as well as Christians "The People of the Book" in the Quran.
for a time i was really interested in sufism, and i've learned a lot about islam.

i understand your good intentions, and that's really nice of you and healthy. but historically, islam was built on identity politics. you might want to read about the umayyad era, and it would be wise to use non-islamic sources.

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are in fact allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is one of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.
https://quran.com/5/51
The idea in the Quran behind separating Muslims from Christians and Jews in worship is one given to create the Muhammedian religion, in order for them to create their own method of worship and their own sets of beliefs. Many religions do this to this day, and it is what you are doing right now in seperating your Buddhism from Islam.
dhammacoustic wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:06 am judging by the hadith (which were compiled two hundred years after the supposed prophet) i personally think muhammad probably never even existed. the word muhammad in arabic literally means "one who is worthy of praise", and it was actually a title for jesus christ, used by the nabatean christians. putting that aside, there are lots of errors in the quran, like moses being jesus' uncle. so it looks like such quranic texts were written mostly based on hearsay, written by people who had no linguistic access to the hebrew bible. it's funny because the quran also acknowledges biblical authority, yet make many false statements about its content.
Considering the massive amount of influence Islam has had on the world you would have to be running away from a part of yourself to say that Muhammed never existed. The Quran revolutionizes a lot of Biblical concepts and puts new interpretations in such ways that give the reader ways to understand the Spiritual aspect of God. If you sense the presence of God while reading the Quran you won't have problems doubting it's authenticity. And the idea of Mary being called a "sister of Imran" is figurative, such as a Spiritual Sister. Much like Jesus is the Son of David.
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dhammacoustic
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by dhammacoustic »

Coëmgenu wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:32 pm (...)

But the thing is, to some Christians living in the area, it is quite plausible for them to have any manner of heterodoxy concerning Mary and Jesus.
yes, there was a female-dominated sect in pre-islamic arabia that worshipped mary. https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print ... yridianism
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dhammacoustic
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by dhammacoustic »

Mahabrahma wrote: Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:46 pm The idea in the Quran behind separating Muslims from Christians and Jews in worship is one given to create the Muhammedian religion, in order for them to create their own method of worship and their own sets of beliefs. Many religions do this to this day, and it is what you are doing right now in seperating your Buddhism from Islam.
do such passages sound like they are coming from an all-inclusive divinity? “hey, don't make friends with christians and jews!”... only a demagogue looking for political dominance would talk like that.

in contemplation we learn the oneness of all things. so imagine a kid growing up reading and memorizing all that. it's just not healthy.
Considering the massive amount of influence Islam has had on the world you would have to be running away from a part of yourself to say that Muhammed never existed. The Quran revolutionizes a lot of Biblical concepts and puts new interpretations in such ways that give the reader ways to understand the Spiritual aspect of God. If you sense the presence of God while reading the Quran you won't have problems doubting it's authenticity. And the idea of Mary being called a "sister of Imran" is figurative, such as a Spiritual Sister. Much like Jesus is the Son of David.
well , derrida had a massive amount of influence on me when he said “there is no outside-text”. you know, like fish in water we all live in language, and we're all unconsciously aware that we need our interpretations, because without them our identities will perish.

i sense the presence of god in everything, but not in a way that helps.

she's called daughter of imran, and sister of aaron, so it's not figurative. they were probably familiar with the name maryam (arabic for mary), but didn't think there could be two of them, so they confused them. just apply occam's razor :)
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Mahabrahma
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by Mahabrahma »

Every single Muslim I know and met has made friends with me and treated me fairly, so they understand the proper way to interpret their doctorine for their times, because of the gift of faith God grants them. Maybe it has been my approach to them, but there is something about Spiritual people of any religion that can truly coexist despite each having their own path, if they are truly following the doctorine of their faith and respecting God, because respecting God means respecting the basic goodness within ourselves, and everyone has the capacity for full goodness--Buddhahood.
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by chownah »

The religion of the Eight Stranded Flying Spaghetti Monster contains the eightfold path.
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

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The religion of the Octopus Leg Path contains the eightfold path.
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

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chownah wrote: Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:18 pm The religion of the Eight Stranded Flying Spaghetti Monster contains the eightfold path.
chownah
chownah wrote: Sat Sep 26, 2020 3:15 pm The religion of the Octopus Leg Path contains the eightfold path.
chownah
These examples make perfect sense . . . . in the world of SarathW. :tongue:

And let's not forget the spiders' eightfold path.
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Re: Can other religions contain eightfold path?

Post by chownah »

A religion can contain the eightfold path to the extend that the eightfold path can be realized by its faithful.....I guess.....don't know for sure.....
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