Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
plabit
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by plabit »

Pondera wrote: Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:53 am
cappuccino wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:04 pm
DNS wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 8:57 pm Secular buddhism = who cares, there's no rebirth anyway.
also known as lying to oneself
Dr. Steve Brule on life after death.
Image
based on his hairdo, who cares what he says?
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Pondera
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Pondera »

plabit wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:08 am
Pondera wrote: Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:53 am
cappuccino wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:04 pm

also known as lying to oneself
Dr. Steve Brule on life after death.
Image
based on his hairdo, who cares what he says?
That’s DOCTOR Steve Brule you’re talking about ya hunk! Better watch it, or Brule ‘l spank your bottom Cherry red!
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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Aloka
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Aloka »

plabit wrote:based on his hairdo, who cares what he says?
Is this a quote from the words of the Buddha, or personal prejudice about someone's appearance?

:thinking:


.
SarathW
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by SarathW »

Can we accept Secular Buddhism as valid Buddhism on the basis (in line with) of Sutta "A Safe Bet"?

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
asahi
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by asahi »

we can accept Secular Buddhism as valid Buddhism , but not true dhamma-vinaya .
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Kim OHara
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Kim OHara »

SarathW wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:33 am Can we accept Secular Buddhism as valid Buddhism on the basis (in line with) of Sutta "A Safe Bet"?

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
I don't know who you're thinking of when you say "we" (and it makes a huge difference) but, for what it's worth, the Safe Bet sutra*
is one of my favourites.
And I don't call myself a Secular Buddhist but I do have rationalist tendencies.

:namaste:
Kim


*The forum software's auto-correct function doesn't like "sutta", which is a bit odd. It doesn't let me type "dhamma", either, unless I go back and fix its :quote: correction :quote:
:coffee:
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retrofuturist
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,
Kim OHara wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:05 am *The forum software's auto-correct function doesn't like "sutta", which is a bit odd. It doesn't let me type "dhamma", either, unless I go back and fix its :quote: correction :quote:
:coffee:
I'm guessing you're on a cell phone, or have some fancy add-on in your browser, because that's certainly not native to the forum software.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Kim OHara
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Kim OHara »

retrofuturist wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:27 am Greetings,
Kim OHara wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:05 am *The forum software's auto-correct function doesn't like "sutta", which is a bit odd. It doesn't let me type "dhamma", either, unless I go back and fix its :quote: correction :quote:
:coffee:
I'm guessing you're on a cell phone, or have some fancy add-on in your browser, because that's certainly not native to the forum software.

Metta,
Paul. :)
No and no, and I am now baffled.
For the record, I'm using Safari, with no extensions at all, on an old iMac running OSX 10.12.x.

:shrug:
Kim

:focus:
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DNS
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by DNS »

plabit wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:08 am
Pondera wrote: Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:53 am
cappuccino wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:04 pm

also known as lying to oneself
Dr. Steve Brule on life after death.
Image
based on his hairdo, who cares what he says?
Don't worry, he's not a real person, it's a fictional character (I didn't know either, I had to look it up).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Check_It_ ... teve_Brule
plabit
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by plabit »

DNS wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:27 pm
plabit wrote: Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:08 am
Pondera wrote: Sun Apr 18, 2021 2:53 am
Dr. Steve Brule on life after death.
Image
based on his hairdo, who cares what he says?
Don't worry, he's not a real person, it's a fictional character (I didn't know either, I had to look it up).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Check_It_ ... teve_Brule
I assumed he was one of the guys from Ancient Aliens.
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Dhammanando
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Dhammanando »

Kim OHara wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:56 am For the record, I'm using Safari, with no extensions at all, on an old iMac running OSX 10.12.x.
Then it will most likely be Safari's in-built spelling checker that's causing the trouble. If you dislike its intrusion, it can be disabled in the Edit menu.
Rūpehi bhikkhave arūpā santatarā.
Arūpehi nirodho santataro ti.


“Bhikkhus, the formless is more peaceful than the form realms.
Cessation is more peaceful than the formless realms.”
(Santatarasutta, Iti 73)
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Kim OHara
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Kim OHara »

Dhammanando wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:25 am
Kim OHara wrote: Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:56 am For the record, I'm using Safari, with no extensions at all, on an old iMac running OSX 10.12.x.
Then it will most likely be Safari's in-built spelling checker that's causing the trouble. If you dislike its intrusion, it can be disabled in the Edit menu.
Thanks. I did work that out but didn't want to take the thread OT again to say so.

:namaste:
Kim
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Rahula
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Rahula »

SarathW wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 9:52 am Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

There are many kind of Buddhist schools. Mahayana, Theravada, Ambdekar, Secular etc.
The question is what is the minimum standard to accept as Buddhist teaching?
- Is that the members take three refuges?
- Is it that the school follows Tipitaka?
- Can I pick and chose and make a new Buddhist school
- If I don't know or understand Kamma Vipaka, rebirth Nibbana, etc can I drop them and make a new school?
- Do secular Buddhist follow Tipitaka or some sort of reference point (book)?
- At what point it could be heretical?
:thinking:
I wanted to ask about different types of Buddhist followers and a quick search pointed to this tread, which had answers.

Thank you all for discussing this topic, I gained some knowledge out of all your posts.
May you be happy, healthy & successful in everything you do! :anjali:
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Dharmasherab
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Dharmasherab »

'Secular Buddhism' is not a form of Buddhism. Firstly because it does not descend from any established monastic lineage that goes back all the way to the Buddha.

There are some features that are required to make a doctrine a form of Buddhism. Belief in rebirth and karma are two of those important aspects which are common to all traditional forms of Buddhism.

We cant say that we are following the teachings of Buddha according to our own schools of Buddhism if we choose to follow aspects which the Buddha clearly spoke out against.

The Samannaphala Sutta (DN 2) shows how Buddha explains about 6 wrong views which existed in Ancient India, three of them are included withing secular Buddhism. Secular Buddhism tends to align itself with materialism, ammoralism and agnosticism - all such beliefs existed in Ancient India which the Buddha clearly rejected.


  • Amoralism - denial of karma by Purana Kassapa
    Materialism - denial of rebirth by Ajitha Kesakambhali
    Agnosticism - suspension of belief by Sanjaya Bellattiputta
So based on these grounds, 'Secular Buddhism' is not a form of Buddhism.
“When one does not understand death, life can be very confusing.” - Ajahn Chah
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Dharmasherab
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Re: Can we accept secular Buddhism as Buddhism?

Post by Dharmasherab »

Buddhism is in two forms of only - Theravada and Mahayana (where Vajayana comes under Mahayana).

Here are the basic points common to all forms of Buddhism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_poi ... 1y%C4%81na
“When one does not understand death, life can be very confusing.” - Ajahn Chah
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