Fabrication does not stop before death and is nutured by tradition and culture.
Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Cleared. αδόξαστος.
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
If I experience pain, which is a feeling, where is the atta in that? If feeling is atta then millions of different attas would rise and fall per day (if not more). How is that a self? If the atta is experiencing the feeling, then it isn’t feeling. So, what then is this atta? Personally I’ve experienced the concept of a self, but like the Buddha and Hume when I partake in an investigation of experience i can’t find anything which corresponds with the concept.Zenny wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:27 pmI am an atta. Every feeling is my atta. Its here,wherever I am. I experienced it with feelings which are mine. An atta is an individual nexus of feelings and will. I've experienced nothing else all my life. How's that for empirical?!
Last edited by Ceisiwr on Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Ah. A materialist nihilist! But no doubt your conceptual scaffolding is less fabricated!
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Of course, there is just seeing words, conditioned processing and conditioned fabrication.
Cleared. αδόξαστος.
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
You are the feeling. Its yours. That is the atta. You can have several feelings at once,all unified by being YOURS. The feelings are the self. Different states of the self.Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:31 pmIf I experience pain, which is a feeling, where is the atta in that? If feeling is atta then millions of different attas would rise and fall per day (if not more). How is that a self? If the atta is experiencing the feeling, then it isn’t feeling. So, what then is this atta? Personally I’ve experienced the concept of a self, but like the Buddha and Hume when I partake in an investigation of experience i can’t find anything which corresponds with the concept.
To me and most others it's self evident,and always is and has been,and will be.
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Lol! And you mister miracle have escaped this conditioning or reduced it to a scaffold! Bravo!
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Sorry, I’m confused here. Is the atta feeling or that which experiences feeling? You still haven’t told me what it is, so currently I haven’t the foggiest idea what you are talking about bar the concept itself. Your reasoning also seems a little circular so far, which would mean it’s a logical fallacy.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Nothing can be escaped from, there is nothing to be escaped from, conditioning just goes on. "Escape" from this or that is just a conditioned buddhist obsession.
Cleared. αδόξαστος.
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Its both. I've just told you above what it is. Feigning confusion won't wash with me matey.
How do you know your experiences are yours? What is that makes you know they are yours? Clue; identity . Your Self.
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
I'm not buddhist. Try reading a little carefully. Less assumptions.
Try to think what my OP is getting at. Ask a question o assumptive one!
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Of course "you are" neither this nor that but buddhist conditioning manifests itself nevertheless when associating "escape from". Your OP is getting at nothing but supports manifesting conditionings nevertheless.Zenny wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:44 pmI'm not buddhist. Try reading a little carefully. Less assumptions.
Try to think what my OP is getting at. Ask a question o assumptive one!
Cleared. αδόξαστος.
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
The irony of this post! The man has brainwashed himself with science and intellectual gymnastics. Then presumes to talk about buddhist conditioning when a buddhist/Hindu term is used.SteRo wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:47 pmOf course "you are" neither this nor that but buddhist conditioning manifests itself nevertheless when associating "escape from". Your OP is getting at nothing but supports manifesting conditionings nevertheless.
If I use the word logic is that Greek conditioning?!
What a caricature and insecure robot you are!
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
How is it both feeling and that which feels? If it’s feeling, then the self rises and dies many times a day. How is the self of one feeling the same self as the other? It also doesn’t tell me what this self is. Feeling is just pain, for example. Where is the atta in the fleeting experience of pain? If it’s what is experiencing pain, what is it? What is atta? What does the concept relate to?Zenny wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:41 pmIts both. I've just told you above what it is. Feigning confusion won't wash with me matey.
How do you know your experiences are yours? What is that makes you know they are yours? Clue; identity . Your Self.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Its both. Simple. It ain't no concept,it's experience.Ceisiwr wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:59 pmHow is it both feeling and that which feels? If it’s feeling, then the self rises and dies many times a day. How is the self of one feeling the same self as the other? It also doesn’t tell me what this self is. Feeling is just pain, for example. Where is the atta in the fleeting experience of pain? If it’s what is experiencing pain, what is it? What is atta? What does the concept relate to?
Non buddhist Zen Practitioner.
Focus!
Focus!
Re: Buddhism and Hinduism on Atman.
Maybe irony, maybe not. It's a display of conditioning. If the word logic is used the conditioning manifests in the concept not in the word.Zenny wrote: ↑Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:52 pmThe irony of this post! The man has brainwashed himself with science and intellectual gymnastics. Then presumes to talk about buddhist conditioning when a buddhist/Hindu term is used.
If I use the word logic is that Greek conditioning?!
What a caricature and insecure robot you are!
"Caricature"?
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/caricatureDefinition of caricature
(Entry 1 of 2)
1 : exaggeration by means of often ludicrous distortion of parts or characteristics
2 : a representation especially in literature or art that has the qualities of caricature
3 : a distortion so gross as to seem like caricature
"Insecure robot"? That seems to be inconsistent since insecurity might be a trait of humans, not of robots. But yes ... there is a similarity with "robot" since there is no "I am" but conditionings drive interactions.
Cleared. αδόξαστος.