Following this discussion: https://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?p=580020#p580020
Particularly:
We experience the rupa and arupa jhāna cittas by doing jhānas. How can devas from those realms experience our cittas?
How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
- rhinoceroshorn
- Posts: 1177
- Joined: Fri May 01, 2020 7:27 pm
How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
Eyes downcast, not footloose,
senses guarded, with protected mind,
not oozing — not burning — with lust,
wander alone
like a rhinoceros.
Sutta Nipāta 1.3 - Khaggavisana Sutta
See, Ānanda! All those conditioned phenomena have passed, ceased, and perished. So impermanent are conditions, so unstable are conditions, so unreliable are conditions. This is quite enough for you to become disillusioned, dispassionate, and freed regarding all conditions.
Dīgha Nikāya 17
senses guarded, with protected mind,
not oozing — not burning — with lust,
wander alone
like a rhinoceros.
Sutta Nipāta 1.3 - Khaggavisana Sutta
See, Ānanda! All those conditioned phenomena have passed, ceased, and perished. So impermanent are conditions, so unstable are conditions, so unreliable are conditions. This is quite enough for you to become disillusioned, dispassionate, and freed regarding all conditions.
Dīgha Nikāya 17
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
What exactly is the 'rupa' experienced in jhana? Why is rupa jhana called 'rupa jhana'?
The above question appears to only arise due to materialistic interpretation of Dhamma. While the above question is not particularly clear, the above question appears to possibly believe:rhinoceroshorn wrote: ↑Sat Sep 12, 2020 7:11 pmHow can devas from those realms experience our cittas?
1. Rupa (physical body) is experienced in jhana
2. Devas do not have a physical body
3. Therefore how can devas experience jhana?
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
- confusedlayman
- Posts: 6231
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 12:16 am
- Location: Human Realm (as of now)
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
even brahmas have physical body they adjust their robes when come to see buddhaDooDoot wrote: ↑Sat Sep 12, 2020 11:34 pmWhat exactly is the 'rupa' experienced in jhana? Why is rupa jhana called 'rupa jhana'?
The above question appears to only arise due to materialistic interpretation of Dhamma. While the above question is not particularly clear, the above question appears to possibly believe:rhinoceroshorn wrote: ↑Sat Sep 12, 2020 7:11 pmHow can devas from those realms experience our cittas?
1. Rupa (physical body) is experienced in jhana
2. Devas do not have a physical body
3. Therefore how can devas experience jhana?
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
If you really want to know what it is like to be a deva you should ask one. Or several. We can have the thread locked while you cultivate fourth jhana powers.
- rhinoceroshorn
- Posts: 1177
- Joined: Fri May 01, 2020 7:27 pm
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
I'll study the Abhidhamma better. The answer may be there.
Eyes downcast, not footloose,
senses guarded, with protected mind,
not oozing — not burning — with lust,
wander alone
like a rhinoceros.
Sutta Nipāta 1.3 - Khaggavisana Sutta
See, Ānanda! All those conditioned phenomena have passed, ceased, and perished. So impermanent are conditions, so unstable are conditions, so unreliable are conditions. This is quite enough for you to become disillusioned, dispassionate, and freed regarding all conditions.
Dīgha Nikāya 17
senses guarded, with protected mind,
not oozing — not burning — with lust,
wander alone
like a rhinoceros.
Sutta Nipāta 1.3 - Khaggavisana Sutta
See, Ānanda! All those conditioned phenomena have passed, ceased, and perished. So impermanent are conditions, so unstable are conditions, so unreliable are conditions. This is quite enough for you to become disillusioned, dispassionate, and freed regarding all conditions.
Dīgha Nikāya 17
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
I thought that the point of bring a deva is that it is really good while it lasts, but that it never does. How does knowing more contribute to seeking Nibbana?
Re: How can rupa/arupa devas experience sense-sphere cittas?
Keep searching, like Kevatta in DN 11.rhinoceroshorn wrote: ↑Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:02 am I'll study the Abhidhamma better. The answer may be there.
In which sutta? Thanks. Regardless, u appear be saying your brother in wandering (R-Horn) is wrong? Or what exactly are you saying, ConfusedLayMan? Thanksconfusedlayman wrote: ↑Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:48 am even brahmas have physical body they adjust their robes when come to see buddha
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati