Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Exploring the Dhamma, as understood from the perspective of the ancient Pali commentaries.
bksubhuti
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Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by bksubhuti »

It was requested that information be brought forth to justify the Abhidhamma and Commentaries, especially suttanta or mula proof.
This monk, Venerable Aggadhammagavesaka was very precise in his talks. Unfortunately, he disrobed in the beginning of the pandemic. I'm not sure where he is now.
Many good points are made in this classic dhammatalk.
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Ontheway
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Ontheway »

bksubhuti wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:42 pm It was requested that information be brought forth to justify the Abhidhamma and Commentaries, especially suttanta or mula proof.
This monk, Venerable Aggadhammagavesaka was very precise in his talks. Unfortunately, he disrobed in the beginning of the pandemic. I'm not sure where he is now.
Many good points are made in this classic dhammatalk.
Why he disrobe?
"Those streams which flow throughout the world, Ajita", said the Lord, "Mindfulness serves to curb them in, This I call the restraint of the streams. But wisdom only turns them off."

(Sn 1035)
BrokenBones
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by BrokenBones »

Perhaps you have a video justifying their existence that doesn't rely on a monk who disrobed?
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robertk
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by robertk »

Much appreciated Venerable.
:anjali:
http://www.abhidhamma.org
https://dhamma.discoursehosting.net/
https://www.youtube.com/user/AlanWeller
MN 26 Pāsarāsisuttaṃ
Pāli: So kho ahaṃ, bhikkhave, tāvatakeneva oṭṭhapahatamattena lapitalāpanamattena ñāṇavādañca vadāmi theravādañca, ‘jānāmi passāmī’ti ca paṭijānāmi ahañceva aññe ca.
Cmy: Theravādanti thirabhāvavādaṃ, thero ahametthāti etaṃ vacanaṃ.
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Ontheway
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Ontheway »

BrokenBones wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 2:37 pm Perhaps you have a video justifying their existence that doesn't rely on a monk who disrobed?
Good point.
"Those streams which flow throughout the world, Ajita", said the Lord, "Mindfulness serves to curb them in, This I call the restraint of the streams. But wisdom only turns them off."

(Sn 1035)
bksubhuti
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by bksubhuti »

The disrobing rate is quite high. Appreciate the work he did while a monk.
If the facts are proper, it does not matter if it is a layperson or a monk giving the information.

If you read my comments about SBS you will see that visas are a problem. He was one of the monks who disrobed because he could not get a proper visa for Malaysia. He had a health problem which he endured for 25 years. I'm sure that had something to do with it. There were probably other reasons too. Don't worry about it.

If someone can take notes on this and transcribe this talk it would be a nice little pamphlet and tribute to this monk's 25 years of service.
sunnat
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Post by sunnat »

Thank you for posting this. Very helpful.
bksubhuti
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by bksubhuti »

The monk above was also the editor of The Most Venerable Pa-Auk Sayadawgyi's Knowing and Seeing and The Workings of Kamma.
I recommend both books but The Workings of Kamma is more urgent to read if you have not read either of them.
Both books are extensively footnoted especially W-O-K with intentions of having the suttas to back things up. It is here where you will find more information about the relationships between the Suttas and Abhidhamma & Commentary system of explanations.
This monk was well aware of the problems which exist with those that deny the Abhidhamma and Commentaries. His absence is a big loss for the English Dhamma Community.
Ekacco Puggalo
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Re: Why did Ven. Aggadhammagavesaka disrobe?

Post by Ekacco Puggalo »

The Venerable Aggadhammagavesaka's poor health prevented him from functioning as a bhikkhu. He could neither meditate nor work on the book he had embarked on with the Most Venerable Pa-Auk Tawya Sayadaw. The only treatment that was of any benefit to him was from a Chinese doctor in Penang. Said doctor told him the bhikkhu life (with its long daily fast, cold food, and often unsuitable food) was why he could never regain his health. He had gone back and forth between Singapore and Penang for years, because the Malaysian authorities refused to give him a medical visa, as his treatment was Chinese medicine. Eventually, they said he could no longer enter Malaysia. His health prevented him from staying at his home monastery Pa-Auk and anywhere else would pose Vinaya problems. So, he was compelled to disrobe. The spirit was willing but the flesh was weak, so to speak. After two years as a layman, he has still not regained his health.
Last edited by Ekacco Puggalo on Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Ceisiwr »

The venerable makes a good point regarding the suttas containing no practical instructions for meditation. This is why a lived tradition is important IMO.
"For that is false, bhikkhu, which has a deceptive nature, and that is true which has an non-deceptive nature—Nibbāna. Therefore a bhikkhu possessing this truth possesses the supreme foundation of truth. For this, bhikkhu, is the supreme noble truth, namely, Nibbāna, which has an non-deceptive nature."

- Dhātuvibhaṅga sutta
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Ceisiwr »

bksubhuti wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:42 pm It was requested that information be brought forth to justify the Abhidhamma and Commentaries, especially suttanta or mula proof.
This monk, Venerable Aggadhammagavesaka was very precise in his talks. Unfortunately, he disrobed in the beginning of the pandemic. I'm not sure where he is now.
Many good points are made in this classic dhammatalk.
The Venerable also has a very calming voice :jumping:
"For that is false, bhikkhu, which has a deceptive nature, and that is true which has an non-deceptive nature—Nibbāna. Therefore a bhikkhu possessing this truth possesses the supreme foundation of truth. For this, bhikkhu, is the supreme noble truth, namely, Nibbāna, which has an non-deceptive nature."

- Dhātuvibhaṅga sutta
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Ontheway
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Re: Why did Ven. Aggadhammagavesaka disrobe?

Post by Ontheway »

Ekacco Puggalo wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 8:33 pm The Venerable Aggadhammagavesaka's poor health prevented him from functioning as a bhikkhu. He could neither meditate nor work on the book he had embarked on with the Most Venerable Pa-Auk Tawya Sayadaw. The only treatment that was of any benefit to him was from a Chinese doctor in Penang. Said doctor told him the bhikkhu life (with its long daily fast, cold food, and often unsuitable food) was why he could never regain his health. He had gone back and forth between Singapore and Penang for years, because the Malaysian authorities refused to give him a medical visa, as his treatment was Chinese medicine. Eventually, they said he could no longer enter Malaysia. His health prevented him from staying at his home monastery Pa-Auk and anywhere else would pose Vinaya problems. So, he was compelled to disrobe. The spirit was willing but the flesh was weak, so to speak. After two years as a layman, he has still not regained his health.
Really sorry to hear that....I wish he can recover soon... Thank you for the information.
"Those streams which flow throughout the world, Ajita", said the Lord, "Mindfulness serves to curb them in, This I call the restraint of the streams. But wisdom only turns them off."

(Sn 1035)
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Ontheway
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Ontheway »

To OP, once again thank you Bksubhuti for the dhamma video. :anjali:

This time, I watched it without skipping. I was amazed by this Suttanta text presented in the video:
“Ye te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū duggahitehi suttantehi byañjanappatirūpakehi atthañca dhammañca paṭibāhanti te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū bahujanāhitāya paṭipannā bahujanāsukhāya, bahuno janassa anatthāya ahitāya dukkhāya devamanussānaṁ. Bahuñca te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū apuññaṁ pasavanti, te cimaṁ saddhammaṁ antaradhāpenti."
Unfortunately, I think this is happening now...with the cultish label so-called "EBT movement" promoted by many "scholars" :(

"Ye te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū suggahitehi suttantehi byañjanappatirūpakehi atthañca dhammañca anulomenti te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū bahujanahitāya paṭipannā bahujanasukhāya, bahuno janassa atthāya hitāya sukhāya devamanussānaṁ. Bahuñca te, bhikkhave, bhikkhū puññaṁ pasavanti, te cimaṁ saddhammaṁ ṭhapentī”ti.
This dhamma video is acting like a 'refreshment' for me... :D

Well, time for me to continue studying Dhammasaṅgaṇī ...
"Those streams which flow throughout the world, Ajita", said the Lord, "Mindfulness serves to curb them in, This I call the restraint of the streams. But wisdom only turns them off."

(Sn 1035)
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retrofuturist
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,
Ceisiwr wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:49 pm The venerable makes a good point regarding the suttas containing no practical instructions for meditation.
Yes they do.

What they don't provide is "practical instructions" to achieve things the Buddha did not teach.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"Why now do you assume 'a being'? Mara, have you grasped a view?" (SN 5.10)

"Overcome the liar by truth." (Dhp 223)
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Video To Justify The Existence Of The Commentaries

Post by Coëmgenu »

IMO, the suttas presume knowledge about the Buddhadharma. They aren't "DIY Dharma handbooks."
Not the one and not another,
unending and impermanent --
of the many Buddhas' transformative teachings,
this is that sweet nectar's taste.

For if a Buddha is not born in the world,
or if the Buddhadharma is completely extinct,
all of the wisdom of the Pratyekabuddhas
would separately arise (from it).

(MMK XVIII.11-12 Madhyamakaśāstra T 1564.23c16)
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