devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by cappuccino »

JamesTheGiant wrote: but then the schools reopened in France and the reports of supernatural beings went down again.
disbelief is just a filter
Laurens
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Laurens »

confusedlayman wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 6:41 pm ancient time in india both in hindu as well as buddhist tradition, devas visited them to tell even small matter but now no one sees them nor deva appear before them voluntierly. why is this ?
There are lots of possible explanations from all different kinds of world views from sceptical to believer.

Perhaps people who claim to have received messages from non human intelligences are treated as insane by modern society? Perhaps they are insane? Perhaps not...

I don't think it's the kind of question you'll get a satisfying and concrete answer to. So find one that makes sense to you and put your mind to other things.
"If only it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?"

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
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zerotime
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by zerotime »

JamesTheGiant wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 8:20 pm It is the same in Europe. Many angels and demons and spirits in the past, but not now.

Researchers have shown the decline in reports of supernatural beings is strongly correlated with the rise of public education.

This was especially seen during the French revolution when the English had schools, but the school system in France completely collapsed. The public in France then reported many many more times the amount of supernatural beings than the English, but then the schools reopened in France and the reports of supernatural beings went down again.
that's logical because rationality usually becomes a tap for the heart.

Unfortunately this primitive civilization don't educate children with a right balance between heart and intellect. Humans are modelated from childhood with billion of psychotic images with animalized sex and ultraviolence. Rationality becomes the only functional rule in society while the heart is leaved as a hidden dimension. Perhaps in the coming future even it will be considered a paranormal activity.

Note today there is a fashion in TV series using autistic and Asperger characters showing an extreme rationality while a lack of emotions. This is funny and trendy. It seems to be a logical evolution of that process of dehumanization for the new generations.
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Flat_plane_V8 »

zerotime wrote: Tue May 26, 2020 8:21 pm
JamesTheGiant wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 8:20 pm It is the same in Europe. Many angels and demons and spirits in the past, but not now.

Researchers have shown the decline in reports of supernatural beings is strongly correlated with the rise of public education.

This was especially seen during the French revolution when the English had schools, but the school system in France completely collapsed. The public in France then reported many many more times the amount of supernatural beings than the English, but then the schools reopened in France and the reports of supernatural beings went down again.
that's logical because rationality usually becomes a tap for the heart.

Unfortunately this primitive civilization don't educate children with a right balance between heart and intellect. Humans are modelated from childhood with billion of psychotic images with animalized sex and ultraviolence. Rationality becomes the only functional rule in society while the heart is leaved as a hidden dimension. Perhaps in the coming future even it will be considered a paranormal activity.

Note today there is a fashion in TV series using autistic and Asperger characters showing an extreme rationality while a lack of emotions. This is funny and trendy. It seems to be a logical evolution of that process of dehumanization for the new generations.


As somebody with diagnosed Asperger's Syndrome, I would say it is welcome to have more representation...This is why Silicon Valley (though no stated Asperger's character, but the pre-presentation scene),Atypical are reasons to celebrate......and regarding supernatural phenomena and claims, they should be ignored unless extraordinary evidence come forward...I can also claim there is a 300 metre Tall Dancing DRagon floating over the Ganges in Calcutta, but nobody can see it
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by zerotime »

Flat_plane_V8 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 6:04 am
As somebody with diagnosed Asperger's Syndrome, I would say it is welcome to have more representation...This is why Silicon Valley (though no stated Asperger's character, but the pre-presentation scene),Atypical are reasons to celebrate......
yes, anyone should celebrate the efforts for social integration of people with mental disorders. Although we shouldn't celebrate the existence of these illnesses.

I try to say the mental disorders should be understood with investigation for solutions and real humanity instead with media shows to get a social acceptance in uncritical ways. In these "normalizations" from the entertainment machine there is an obvious offer to avoid questions about the real problematic of these persons and the abnormal increase of these illness (autism, asperger...) in our days.
and regarding supernatural phenomena and claims, they should be ignored unless extraordinary evidence come forward...I can also claim there is a 300 metre Tall Dancing DRagon floating over the Ganges in Calcutta, but nobody can see it
that's a problem about the nature of knowledge. If you have seen it, the seeing was real. If no more people can see the same thing, then you should investigate if it was an hallucination or not.

Rejection of phenomena just because it cannot be shared, this is not a proof about some reality. We can share the knowledge of an illusion and also sharing the ignorance of a real phenomena. Progress of human knowledge always is developed from individual visions, intuitions, suspicions and beliefs. Towards what remains invisible or unknown. An approach of knowledge devoid of these ingredients it belongs to some operator of an intellectual machinery, something closer to a dogmatic system.
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Flat_plane_V8 »

zerotime wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 9:14 pm Although we shouldn't celebrate the existence of these illnesses.

I try to say the mental disorders should be understood with investigation for solutions and real humanity instead with media shows to get a social acceptance in uncritical ways. In these "normalizations" from the entertainment machine there is an obvious offer to avoid questions about the real problematic of these persons and the abnormal increase of these illness (autism, asperger...) in our days.

that's a problem about the nature of knowledge. If you have seen it, the seeing was real. If no more people can see the same thing, then you should investigate if it was an hallucination or not.

Rejection of phenomena just because it cannot be shared, this is not a proof about some reality. We can share the knowledge of an illusion and also sharing the ignorance of a real phenomena. Progress of human knowledge always is developed from individual visions, intuitions, suspicions and beliefs. Towards what remains invisible or unknown. An approach of knowledge devoid of these ingredients it belongs to some operator of an intellectual machinery, something closer to a dogmatic system.
Autism,asperger's are genetic conditions...You donot suddenly develop it or contract it..You are born that way..just like you are born with a certain skin colour etc. It's just that we have better detection resources

If not a single other person can detect independently or verify independently what you are detecting, that's the text book case of hallucination or delusion...and IS NOT in the realm of Knowledge..
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by zerotime »

Flat_plane_V8 wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 9:33 pm If not a single other person can detect independently or verify independently what you are detecting, that's the text book case of hallucination or delusion...and IS NOT in the realm of Knowledge..
yes, it is knowledge. A certainty is not real when it can be shared; it is real when there is no error.

Can I suggest:

http://www.mesacc.edu/~barsp59601/text/ ... epist.html

https://www.quora.com/Mathematically-sp ... e-universe

https://philosophynow.org/issues/102/Do ... _Scientism

Image
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by seeker242 »

confusedlayman wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 6:41 pm ancient time in india both in hindu as well as buddhist tradition, devas visited them to tell even small matter but now no one sees them nor deva appear before them voluntierly. why is this ?
No one sees them now, according to who?
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by confusedlayman »

seeker242 wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 11:40 am
confusedlayman wrote: Fri May 15, 2020 6:41 pm ancient time in india both in hindu as well as buddhist tradition, devas visited them to tell even small matter but now no one sees them nor deva appear before them voluntierly. why is this ?
No one sees them now, according to who?
Devas advised bahia that he is not arhant, devas talk to citta householder, devas speak to indian village grandma (i realise one event in my childhood) etc so it is not rare but now its rare but people still see it.
dont think
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Flat_plane_V8 »

zerotime wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 7:07 am
yes, it is knowledge. A certainty is not real when it can be shared; it is real when there is no error.

Can I suggest:

http://www.mesacc.edu/~barsp59601/text/ ... epist.html

https://www.quora.com/Mathematically-sp ... e-universe

https://philosophynow.org/issues/102/Do ... _Scientism

Image
Psychic superpowers, supernatural powers, paranormal powers simply cannot exist..We may not know a lot about Physics at the quantum scale or the big Universal Scale..But physics on the human or Earth scale has been COMPLETELY SOLVED....and given that all human beings that have ever existed have been born on earth only, we can say with full confidence that claims of interaction with devas or possession of superpowers are just exaggerations of pre-scientific or non-scientific people

Noted physicist Sean Caroll says why Telekinetic superpowers are not possible

https://web.archive.org/web/20151117073 ... d-theory/

A Physicist Explained Why The Large Hadron Collider Disproves The Existence of Ghosts


https://www.sciencealert.com/a-physicis ... -of-ghosts
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by confusedlayman »

Flat_plane_V8 wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 8:29 pm
zerotime wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 7:07 am
yes, it is knowledge. A certainty is not real when it can be shared; it is real when there is no error.

Can I suggest:

http://www.mesacc.edu/~barsp59601/text/ ... epist.html

https://www.quora.com/Mathematically-sp ... e-universe

https://philosophynow.org/issues/102/Do ... _Scientism

Image
Psychic superpowers, supernatural powers, paranormal powers simply cannot exist..We may not know a lot about Physics at the quantum scale or the big Universal Scale..But physics on the human or Earth scale has been COMPLETELY SOLVED....and given that all human beings that have ever existed have been born on earth only, we can say with full confidence that claims of interaction with devas or possession of superpowers are just exaggerations of pre-scientific or non-scientific people

Noted physicist Sean Caroll says why Telekinetic superpowers are not possible

https://web.archive.org/web/20151117073 ... d-theory/

A Physicist Explained Why The Large Hadron Collider Disproves The Existence of Ghosts


https://www.sciencealert.com/a-physicis ... -of-ghosts
Those scientist take things exist view and stick with conventional reality.
dont think
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Flat_plane_V8 »

confusedlayman wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 10:56 am

Those scientist take things exist view and stick with conventional reality.
Quite frankly other realities donot eixst..India is the most spiritual country on earth and has been so for the past few thousand years...Indian texts are bursting at the seams with tales of superpowers ...Yet civilizations grounded in more conventional realities have run over, conquered and despolied that country innumerable times

starting with the Persians in 500 BCE during the time of the Buddha..the Brahmans and the ascetics at Taxila could have just used their supernatural powers and stopped the invasion

there has been one invasion from the north west after the other...and not a single yogi could wield any supwerpower to stop these invaders...i would say preoccupation with these speculative superpowers ridden texts has rendered India into a mediocre civilization...while more rational based civilizations have ascended...be it Turkic Muslim invaders or pre islamic invaders like Persians,Greeks,Huns,Kushanas---->all of whom were grounded in the rational reality of cause and effect rather than vague, mystical Karma based causality theories of Indians ...(Like if I stick a sword into my enemy he will die rather than this act will invite the wrath of bad karma)
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by confusedlayman »

Flat_plane_V8 wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 3:27 pm
confusedlayman wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 10:56 am

Those scientist take things exist view and stick with conventional reality.
Quite frankly other realities donot eixst..India is the most spiritual country on earth and has been so for the past few thousand years...Indian texts are bursting at the seams with tales of superpowers ...Yet civilizations grounded in more conventional realities have run over, conquered and despolied that country innumerable times

starting with the Persians in 500 BCE during the time of the Buddha..the Brahmans and the ascetics at Taxila could have just used their supernatural powers and stopped the invasion

there has been one invasion from the north west after the other...and not a single yogi could wield any supwerpower to stop these invaders...i would say preoccupation with these speculative superpowers ridden texts has rendered India into a mediocre civilization...while more rational based civilizations have ascended...be it Turkic Muslim invaders or pre islamic invaders like Persians,Greeks,Huns,Kushanas---->all of whom were grounded in the rational reality of cause and effect rather than vague, mystical Karma based causality theories of Indians ...(Like if I stick a sword into my enemy he will die rather than this act will invite the wrath of bad karma)
Yogis never used as they dont concern about the world and wars. "Dismissing something completly because we cant know that and hence coming to conclusion that what we dont know dont exist is keeping crown of ignorance in head" - sadhguru
dont think
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by zerotime »

Flat_plane_V8 wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 8:29 pm A Physicist Explained Why The Large Hadron Collider Disproves The Existence of Ghosts

https://www.sciencealert.com/a-physicis ... -of-ghosts
interesting what this man says:

"If we want some sort of pattern that carries information about our living cells to persist, then we must specify precisely what medium carries that pattern, and how it interacts with the matter particles out of which our bodies are made,"


that problem about the transmission of something invisible, it sounds really similar to the Gravity problem, which nobody know what is it. There are quite scientific ghosts: gravity, photons...

Science also should live with their own land of ghosts and the Unknown in order to keep the coherence of their own system. To preserve its own health and productive life. This should be a lesson to get a wider perspective and rethink the role of knowledge, to surpass the present primitive materialism. When Science need to carry a coexistence with their own ghosts and the unknown, the same happens with the human being.
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Re: devas visited indian people ancient time but not now?

Post by Flat_plane_V8 »

zerotime wrote: Fri May 29, 2020 4:56 pm
that problem about the transmission of something invisible, it sounds really similar to the Gravity problem, which nobody know what is it. There are quite scientific ghosts: gravity, photons...

Science also should live with their own land of ghosts and the Unknown in order to keep the coherence of their own system. To preserve its own health and productive life. This should be a lesson to get a wider perspective and rethink the role of knowledge, to surpass the present primitive materialism. When Science need to carry a coexistence with their own ghosts and the unknown, the same happens with the human being.

We know and can predict the effect of gravity (even if we donot know gravity..Like we can figure out Gravoty was in the apartment..if gravity was a man)..we cannot know or predict the effect of ghosts or devas...completely different scenarios
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