Suffering is vital condition for faith

Textual analysis and comparative discussion on early Buddhist sects and scriptures.
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P Chaudhuri
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Suffering is vital condition for faith

Post by P Chaudhuri »

In Upanisa Sutta ( SN 12.23 , Vital conditions ) the Buddha says that "...suffering is a vital condition for faith..". Does this faith refers to faith in dhamma ?
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Sam Vara
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Re: Suffering is vital condition for faith

Post by Sam Vara »

P Chaudhuri wrote: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:13 pm In Upanisa Sutta ( SN 12.23 , Vital conditions ) the Buddha says that "...suffering is a vital condition for faith..". Does this faith refers to faith in dhamma ?
I think it does, but don't forget faith in the Buddha and the Sangha as well.
JohnK
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Re: Suffering is vital condition for faith

Post by JohnK »

Bhikkhu Bodhi's exposition of the Upanisa Sutta says
...the Buddha says that faith has for its nutriment hearing exposition of the true Dhamma. [11] Saddha...is essentially an attitude of trust and commitment directed to ultimate emancipation.
At footnote [11]
AN 10.61 Ko caharo saddhaya? Saddhammassavananti'ssa vacaniyam.
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/aut ... el277.html
To me, he seems to suggest a possibly intervening step where one's suffering begins to be seen as more than the result of occasional external impingement on an otherwise manageable and satisfying world -- so one is ready to actually "hear" the Dhamma when presented.
Those who grasp at perceptions & views wander the internet creating friction. [based on Sn4:9,v.847]
dharmacorps
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Re: Suffering is vital condition for faith

Post by dharmacorps »

The Buddha taught only "suffering and the end of suffering". If you don't see, understand, or experience suffering (or, claim you don't) then how can you have faith in his teachings?
Srilankaputra
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Re: Suffering is vital condition for faith

Post by Srilankaputra »

P Chaudhuri wrote: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:13 pm ...suffering is a vital condition for faith.."
“And what is the result of stress? There are some cases in which a
person overcome with pain, his mind exhausted, grieves, mourns,
laments, beats his breast, & becomes bewildered. Or one overcome with
pain, his mind exhausted, comes to search outside, ‘Who knows a way or
two to stop this pain?’ I tell you, monks, that stress results either in
bewilderment or in search.” — AN 6:63

Lokāmisaṃ pajahe santipekkho ti
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