Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the formula?

Textual analysis and comparative discussion on early Buddhist sects and scriptures.
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David ceballos
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Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the formula?

Post by David ceballos »

Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the formula?
as I had understood it was necessary to develop the 4 satipatthanas to develop the 7 factors of awakening but in the section of the MN 118 that talks about “the factors of awakening” it seems not to be so… each satipatthana seems to be self-conclusive without the need of others… which led me to think that maybe “the formula itself is not so literal”…
It is also the same with the Brahma Viharas (as opposed to the satipatthanas) in SN 46,54… it seems that each brahma vihara can do the same, although curiously they have the same structure as the MN 118 in the mentioned part …

thanks in advance for your help, metta :anjali:
SarathW
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by SarathW »

This is a good question.
Can you give some info to support the op?
I can't recall reading the Sutta like that.

However, my understanding is that all Satipathana practice together at once.
It is not like, I practice Kayanupassana this week and Vedananupassana next week etc.
Every moment you must be able to see that four Stipathana arise and perishes.
When you practice as such the seven factors of enlightenment arise starting from eliminating five hindrances.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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DooDoot
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by DooDoot »

David ceballos wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:56 pm Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening... ?
Yes. However, the seven factors, particularly those related to concentration (such as energy, rapture, tranquility & concentration) and also equanimity will become more refined with each consecutive satipatthana.

For example, the concentration developed from calming the breathing will not be as refined as the concentration from calming the pleasant feelings. Then the concentration from purifying the mind (citta) itself will be even more refined.
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Assaji
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by Assaji »

David ceballos wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:56 pm Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the formula?
The Ānāpāna Vagga and the Nirodha Vagga of the Bojjhaṅga Saṃyutta (SN 46.57-76) explain that the items listed in the Satipaṭṭhāna Sutta and the Ānāpānassati Sutta, — namely, a skeleton, a worm-infested, livid, dismembered or bloated corpse, breathing, unattractiveness, inconstancy, dispassion and cessation, — can serve as bases for the development of the seven enlightenment factors.
Jack19990101
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by Jack19990101 »

Yes, you could choose one of them as primary and reach release, thoeretically.
But as the subtlety is getting finer one by one, it requires stronger samadhi to contemplate.
Hence, it is not realistic to be mindful of mind/dhamma, except some crude thoughts, without developing samadhi.
SarathW
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by SarathW »

DooDoot wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:17 am
David ceballos wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 6:56 pm Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening... ?
Yes. However, the seven factors, particularly those related to concentration (such as energy, rapture, tranquility & concentration) and also equanimity will become more refined with each consecutive satipatthana.

For example, the concentration developed from calming the breathing will not be as refined as the concentration from calming the pleasant feelings. Then the concentration from purifying the mind (citta) itself will be even more refined.
:goodpost:
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
asahi
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by asahi »

DooDoot wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:17 am For example, the concentration developed from calming the breathing will not be as refined as the concentration from calming the pleasant feelings. Then the concentration from purifying the mind (citta) itself will be even more refined.
Hi DD
In what sense do you mean "mind" ?
It seems the feeling perception are what constitute the mind ! :roll:

:thanks:
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DooDoot
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by DooDoot »

asahi wrote: Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:39 am In what sense do you mean "mind" ?
It seems the feeling perception are what constitute the mind !
No. Feeling & perception are not "citta". Refer to MN 10.

The word feelings & perceptions are "cittasankhara" means feelings & perceptions condition the citta, such as pleasant feeling causes the citta to have greed and unpleasant feeling causes the citta to have anger.

Please don't ask again. We have discussed this many times in our past lives & reincarnations here. :thanks:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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asahi
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by asahi »

DooDoot wrote: Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:59 am ...
Ok never mind .

:thanks:
Last edited by Dhammanando on Fri Jul 02, 2021 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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SarathW
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Re: Can each satipatthana object itself develop the seven factors of awakening or is this an error/ambiguity in the form

Post by SarathW »

asahi wrote: Fri Jul 02, 2021 4:36 am
DooDoot wrote: Fri Jul 02, 2021 3:59 am ...
Ok never mind .

:thanks:
Hi Ashi
Your question is a valid one.
Unfortunately you will never understand this unless you understand Abhidamma.
In Abhidhamma the consciousness is discussed in two ways as Citta and Citasika.
Generally the Citta are the six senses (eye, ear etc) conditioned by attachement, aversion and ignotance. There are 121 Cittas as per Abhidhamma.
Then those Citta further elevated as 52 Cetacikas.
Vedana and Sanna are two of the cetacikas and the other 50 termed as Sankhara.
Please read the following article.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/aut ... el322.html
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
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