Material contribution of monks to society

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.
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TamHanhHi
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Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:28 pm

Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by TamHanhHi »

There's tons of things won't could do—but I'm not sure it really matters whether people want to support Buddhist monks or not. I also wouldn't lump Westerners into one broad category. The view you described isn't a Western view, it's a Protestant view (which, fair enough, is a predominant view in the West). Other religions (also found in the West) with monastic orders operate on the same notion of generosity, that a spiritual pursuit is inherently beneficial to society. You'd be surprised how many people are actually much more interested in supporting monks with food than with money, just for the fact of doing it.
"Just as a large banyan tree, on level ground where four roads meet, is a haven for the birds all around, even so a lay person of conviction is a haven for many people: monks, nuns, male lay followers, & female lay followers."AN 5.38
Saaz
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:48 pm

Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by Saaz »

I was always interested in finding ways on how Buddhist monasticism can be integrated into contemporary western society.

What monks do, is to fully practice Buddhist teachings because to them is the only reasonable thing to do and in doing so, they end up fostering Buddhism. So, until people will be interested in Buddhist teachings, Buddhism will prosper; people will buy books, have retreats or simply donate. If not, Buddhism will die. I don't think the solution to better integrate Buddhism into society would be to produce some sort of service or product, in a conventional way, because in this way you would actually corrupt what Buddhism is about. In a sense, this system is really beautiful.

On a personal level, It's from the moment that I learned about Buddhism that I keep thinking of living as a monastic, but after almost ten years I'm still of the idea of keep working and practice as a layman. Maybe more people will start to appreciate Buddhism and will join, maybe not.
DiamondNgXZ
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Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by DiamondNgXZ »

Saaz wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:51 pm
On a personal level, It's from the moment that I learned about Buddhism that I keep thinking of living as a monastic, but after almost ten years I'm still of the idea of keep working and practice as a layman. Maybe more people will start to appreciate Buddhism and will join, maybe not.
So? What's stopping you now. Go forth from the dusty home life to homelessness. Don't waste this precious opportunity for liberation!

For the OP topic, I see it as it's so rare to have people willing to devote themselves to the path full time, so it's good to support them. So that when it's the lay people's time to get out, they can also have support. Pay it forward.

It's no issue to have only faithful, generous Buddhists who are the only ones giving alms to the monastics. It's quite unreasonable to ask people of other faiths to support what they don't believe in or see any value in. Besides, it's all by one's own free will, not being forced. Indeed, it would be the natural way to get monastics at new places is to grow the no. of lay Buddhists who are willing to support monastics locally first. Monasteries costs money to build, and where does the money comes from? Locals. Who would benefit? Those who are willing to go into the monasteries to donate (get merits), listen to Dhamma talks, meditate, go for retreats etc.

If secular mindfulness can charge super expensive amount to teach people, it's clearly much cheaper to feed the monastics and attend our free dhamma talks, meditation guides etc. It's just simple economic sense!
Saaz
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:48 pm

Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by Saaz »

DiamondNgXZ wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 3:38 am So? What's stopping you now. Go forth from the dusty home life to homelessness. Don't waste this precious opportunity for liberation!
After my last post, I went for a couple of months to a Zen temple in France. At the moment I still want to have an income and have economic security, moreover, I don't really think that staying in the place where I have been would benefit so much my practice. I'm planning to spend another period in a monastery, this time is from a Theravada tradition where I once did a retreat with the abbot. If I'll ever be a monastic it will probably be after I've spent some time with a community that I find suitable and when I'll be more sure that leaving my job and everything will not be a regret.
DiamondNgXZ
Posts: 390
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2021 5:40 am

Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by DiamondNgXZ »

Saaz wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 11:00 am
DiamondNgXZ wrote: Sat Jun 04, 2022 3:38 am So? What's stopping you now. Go forth from the dusty home life to homelessness. Don't waste this precious opportunity for liberation!
After my last post, I went for a couple of months to a Zen temple in France. At the moment I still want to have an income and have economic security, moreover, I don't really think that staying in the place where I have been would benefit so much my practice. I'm planning to spend another period in a monastery, this time is from a Theravada tradition where I once did a retreat with the abbot. If I'll ever be a monastic it will probably be after I've spent some time with a community that I find suitable and when I'll be more sure that leaving my job and everything will not be a regret.
https://sasanarakkha.org/

Can try my monastery here.
Alino
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Re: Material contribution of monks to society

Post by Alino »

What is the material contribution of teachers, psycologist, philosophers?

What is the benefit for the society to do good, avoid bad and purify the mind?

What is the benefit of having brakes for a car?

They produce social and psychological assistance to people. Any way, if people dont want to support monks - they don't, so there is no such a problem as "unfair livelihood" of monks who do nothing, because they are living upon free will generosity...
We don't live Samsara, Samsara is living us...

"Form, feelings, perceptions, formations, consciousness - don't care about us, we don't exist for them"
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