Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Ceisiwr »

The ideal Buddhist system is monarchy, rather than democracy or degenerate Fascism. Obviously we don’t live in an ideal world but we can still aim for stability and moderate conservatism so as to have the next best of societies if we wish to be political (something I’m personally becoming less concerned with myself). Some kind of monarchy would feature in that society, even if it’s constitutional.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by sphairos »

Ceisiwr wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:47 pm The ideal Buddhist system is monarchy, rather than democracy or degenerate Fascism. Obviously we don’t live in an ideal world but we can still aim for stability and moderate conservatism so as to have the next best of societies if we wish to be political (something I’m personally becoming less concerned with myself). Some kind of monarchy would feature in that society, even if it’s constitutional.
Aha, monarchy where a king conquers everyone by his righteousness, not by armies. This is a fairy-tale for consolation of the monarchy-sympathizers of the time.

In reality the Buddha didn't leave a successor and imagined as an ideal free classless society, i.e. democracy in the broad meaning of the term. This was his Realpolitik.

If he was a monarchist he would have said it openly and appointed a Sangharājā for the Order.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by nmjojola »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:59 pm Evola was a fascist -- if you like Evola, you are buying into that.
That is the same type of thinking that goes on between cliquey children on gradeschool playgrounds - it's immature, and the assertion is simply not true.

I can appreciate the voraciousness of the lion which takes down a gazelle, that doesn't mean I'm "buying into" the killing of animals. The Buddha often used the appreciable qualities in the strong man who beats down with brute force a weaker man into submission and defeat for a point of praxis, that doesn't mean he was "buying into" violence.

Similarly, I can appreciate some of the work of Evola, without buying into Fascism.
Last edited by nmjojola on Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Dhammanando »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:07 pm Now what was it you were saying?
As a Don Quixote fan I was giving you a nice girl guide salute as a token of thanks for the amusement your windmill-tilting has afforded me.

.
saluting.jpg
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Ceisiwr »

sphairos wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:07 pm

Aha, monarchy where a king conquers everyone by his righteousness, not by armies. This is a fairy-tale for consolation of the monarchy-sympathizers of the time.
I think the key word in my post was “ideal”. Still, monarchy is obviously something the Buddha accepted. What matters is what type of monarchy it is.
In reality the Buddha didn't leave a successor and imagined as an ideal free classless society, i.e. democracy in the broad meaning of the term. This was his Realpolitik.
This is merely confusing a religious organisation with society at large.
classless society
Urgh, the whiff of communism. How repellent.
If he was a monarchist he would have said it openly and appointed a Sangharājā for the Order.
He spoke positively of monarchy and, once again, you are blurring the sangha with society at large.
Last edited by Ceisiwr on Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by nmjojola »

sphairos wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:07 pm
Ceisiwr wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:47 pm The ideal Buddhist system is monarchy, rather than democracy...
If he was a monarchist he would have said it openly.
I think ceisiwr is correct here, any plain reading of the suttas shows that the common folk don't know what's best for themselves, and that they are benefited when led by noble ones who have the power and responsibility to do so. He (the Buddha) used monarchist archetypes frequently in his teachings.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by DNS »

Dhammanando wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 3:53 pm
Don Quixote de la Mancha wrote: I repeat --

"Evola was a fascist -- if you like Evola, you are buying into that. There's no way round it.
Then it's a jolly good thing that we've got you here to warn us about him! I mean if there's one thing Dhamma Wheel's famous for it's our gigantic vanguard of Julius Evola fans. The forum these days seems to be positively teeming with them. I might have been in danger of becoming one myself if I hadn't learned from you that he was a fascist of all things. Phew, what a relief.

:rofl:
.
:thumbsup:

And this also reminds me of George W. Bush's infamous:
"You're either with us, or you're against us."

All of which is the false dilemma fallacy.

If Hitler said the earth is a sphere and we agreed with him on this, that wouldn't make us Nazis.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

Jgood wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:03 pmAlthough the Buddha often stated that distinctions in class and gender were meaningless in the context of the Sangha, Dhamma practice, and creating Kamma, never once does he argue for the reformation of the highly inegalitarian Indian society of his day, from which we can conclude that such a society was not antithetical to Dhamma.
If you know something of the history of the Saint Thomas Christians in India, you know that when you challenge the caste system, your entire demographic is regulated into untouchability. If the Buddha had completely ignored caste, ancient Indian bigots would have regulated "the Dhammavinaya" into a religion only fit for people who perform cremations. No Buddhist kings. No Buddhist Brahmins. They wouldn't dare touch it. Reputation is everything in the minds of worldlings.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:30 pm America, the declining Empire, rotting from the inside, gorged on their own history of violence and lynchings, now desperately looks for role models in fading fascists like Evola and dreary old long forgotten British conservatives - and all this on a Dhamma board ! You couldn't make it up!
"America" doesn't have a DhammaWheel account. I'm as upset about Nazis as you, but no declining empires have accounts here and post in this thread.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Ceisiwr »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:30 pm America, the declining Empire, rotting from the inside, gorged on their own history of violence and lynchings, now desperately looks for role models in fading fascists like Evola and dreary old long forgotten British conservatives - and all this on a Dhamma board ! You couldn't make it up!

See you lot at the next Nazi youth rally ! When you are guys joining MOGTOW and incel groups? You probably belong to them already. How many of you support Brevik and the NZ shooter? More than a few I'd say judging from your posts.

This board is a joke, I don't start me on the Australian wannabe arahants here...

( my post does not refer to coemgu, but it does refer to the rest of you fascist nut case wackos , wracked in bitter resentiment)
Quite a number of the people who commented aren’t American nor fascist, myself included.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

Please don't say I'm "fine" etc. in such ways and contrast me with the rest of the forum. I get you are trying to be nice, but I find it a bit "cringey."
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

I'm making myself cringe? That's a possibility, I suppose.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:38 pmAnd if you want to be collectivised with the rest of the incels and Alex Jones freaks on this forum, well, be my guest. See you at the next right wing MOGTOW rally.
Ah, a little edit on your post. I suppose I'm an Alex Jones freak now. That's how quick it can happen, folks, when your Alex Jones freak level is determined by a gnostic mind.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:41 pmThe reputation of this board is well known -- my email box was alive yesterday with Australian and English monastics who are watching this thread with growing nausea and disgust.
I've beat you to the punch in informing the administrators that many monastics think that the twin wheels are a joke. They are already well-aware of the state of the reputation game.

But then again, I'm an Alex Jones freak. I'm probably lying.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by GnosticMind »

That's your choice.

Not mine.

I know what many Sangha think of this board -- I have heard it from them directly.
Last edited by GnosticMind on Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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