Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Discussion of ordination, the Vinaya and monastic life. How and where to ordain? Bhikkhuni ordination etc.
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DooDoot
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by DooDoot »

Coëmgenu wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 6:46 am Don't be ignorant, DooDoot.
:roll:
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viewtopic.php?f=47&t=2
what is a "samgha"? :shrug:
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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Coëmgenu
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

I asked you not to be ignorant, DooDoot.

https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/niggahita

You can do better next time by heeding advice.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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DooDoot
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by DooDoot »

Coëmgenu wrote:
You can do better next time by heeding advice.
Buddha followers don’t take advice from heretics. There is no such thing as samgha in Theravada
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

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Aloka
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Aloka »

GnosticMind wrote:Hey Dhammanando, well my man -- if you want to stand up for a racist fascist -- be my guest. It's up to you
Being disrespectful to Ven. Dhammanando is not helpful to a discussion (or to youself).




:anjali:
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Aloka
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Aloka »

GnosticMind wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:07 pm Dhammanando wrote, in a shrill girl-guide like passive aggressive manner
.....
.....
Now what was it you were saying?
Being so rude to a monk doesn't do you any favours at all and makes your choice of username seem absolutely ridiculous.


Regarding the topic title - thankfully I've never heard of him, so reading all the ranting is pointless!

:hello:
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Sam Vara
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Sam Vara »

Aloka wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 10:39 am
GnosticMind wrote:Hey Dhammanando, well my man -- if you want to stand up for a racist fascist -- be my guest. It's up to you
Being disrespectful to Ven. Dhammanando is not helpful to a discussion (or to youself).




:anjali:
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DooDoot
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by DooDoot »

Aloka wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 11:06 am makes your choice of username seem absolutely ridiculous.
It seems ridiculous regardless for a Buddhist forum. Gnostic is a Xtian term.
retrofuturist wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:09 pm It wouldn't surprise me if it's etymologically connected to ñana, but it's time to get...
Regardless, the same is still non-sequitur for users of street gutter language.
The term Gnosticism was derived from the use of the Greek adjective gnostikos (Greek γνωστικός, "learned" :roll: , "intellectual" :roll: ) ....
:alien:
Coëmgenu wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:11 pm Not ready for it, I suppose?
There is no "samgha" in the Pali language used on this forum. "samgha" with small "s" appears to indicate rebelliousness against Theravada. Paul Retro the moderator said:

:focus:
Coëmgenu wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:25 pm Modedation had more than time to take that down if they felt it was an overreaction to GnosticMind's contrarian reaction and generalization of forum participants just because DooDoot and a few others have extreme politics.
Dhammapada says: "Difficult indeed is self-control".

:focus:
Coëmgenu wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 12:11 pm More displays of ignorance out of you because you mistake Pali romanization for Pāli.
You had to search hard for those spelling errors on obscure texts. :roll:

:focus:
Aloka wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:02 pm
May I quickly be so bold as to ask what exactly is pospturing? .....perhaps I could recognise it if I knew what it was!
The manic loss of self-control has set in. :console:
Coëmgenu wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 1:05 pm Pretending that or presenting yourself in a way such that it might seem to someone who doesn't know any better than you have a clue what you are talking about vis-a-vis the "correct spelling" of the Pali term samgha when it is transliterated into Roman characters is "posturing" here.
The impression is Coëmgenu was posting "samgha" from Mahayana. Now Coëmgenu is claiming to be posting Pali.
Sanskrit संघ
(IAST: saṃgha)
Pali saṅgha
:smile:
Last edited by DooDoot on Sat May 01, 2021 1:08 pm, edited 12 times in total.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
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retrofuturist
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,

It wouldn't surprise me if it's etymologically connected to ñana, but it's time to get...

:focus:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

DooDoot wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 9:53 amThere is no such thing as samgha in Theravada
More displays of ignorance out of you because you mistake Pali romanization for Pāli. There most certainly is something called the samgha in Theravāda. You should be heedful and mindful and then you won't do silly things like think that the "n" in sangha is anything more than one particular way to realize the niggāhita in Latin transliteration. If you were careful, you wouldn't make fool assertions like on this thread.

I literally linked you to the explanation of the niggāhita. Not ready for it, I suppose?

Here is something for you. It would have taken you only a moment to find this on Google using the word "saṃgho," but you have no clue what you are talking about for all your posturing. So here it is for you, the Theravadin samgha as attested to in the Theravadin vinaya.
Paṭhamaṃ kesamassuṃ ohārāpetvā, kāsāyāni vatthāni acchādāpetvā, ekaṃsaṃ uttarāsaṅgaṃ kārāpetvā, bhikkhūnaṃ pāde vandāpetvā, ukkuṭikaṃ nisīdāpetvā, añjaliṃ paggaṇhāpetvā ‘evaṃ vadehī’ti vattabbo—

‘Buddhaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Dhammaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Saṃghaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi.

Dutiyampi buddhaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Dutiyampi dhammaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Dutiyampi saṃghaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi.

Tatiyampi buddhaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Tatiyampi dhammaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmi,
Tatiyampi saṃghaṃ saraṇaṃ gacchāmī’ti.
(Pi Tv Kd 1)

Here's something else that shows up with that same basic Google search:
Tena samayena buddho bhagavā sāvatthiyaṃ viharati jetavane anāthapiṇḍikassa ārāme. Tena kho pana samayena thullanandā bhikkhunī saṃghena samanubhaṭṭhā bhikkhuniyo evaṃ vadeti—“saṃsaṭṭhāva, ayye, tumhe viharatha. Mā tumhe nānā viharittha. Santi saṃghe aññāpi bhikkhuniyo evācārā evaṃsaddā evaṃsilokā, bhikkhunisaṃghassa vihesikā, aññamaññissā vajjappaṭicchādikā. Tā saṃgho na kiñci āha. Tumhaññeva saṃgho uññāya paribhavena akkhantiyā vebhassiyā dubbalyā evamāha—‘bhaginiyo kho saṃsaṭṭhā viharanti pāpācārā pāpasaddā pāpasilokā, bhikkhunisaṃghassa vihesikā, aññamaññissā vajjappaṭicchādikā. Viviccathāyye. Vivekaññeva bhaginīnaṃ saṃgho vaṇṇetī’”ti.
(Saṅghādisesā 13)

Please educating yourself before trying this again. You have no idea what you are talking about at it stands.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Sat May 01, 2021 1:10 pm, edited 8 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
48vows
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by 48vows »

Coëmgenu wrote: Tue Apr 27, 2021 11:47 pm You're being an outright ass now
I know that name calling is allowed on the other wheel. But let’s not do that here too
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings,

Come on lads... you know this has got nothing to do with the topic.

:focus:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Aloka »

Coëmgenu wrote:you have no clue what you are talking about for all your pospturing.
May I quickly be so bold as to ask what exactly is pospturing? .....perhaps I could recognise it if I knew what it was!

:?:


.
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by Coëmgenu »

Presenting yourself in a way such that it might seem to someone who doesn't know any better than you have a clue what you are talking about vis-a-vis the "correct spelling" of the Pali term samgha when it is transliterated into Roman characters is "posturing" here.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
nmjojola
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by nmjojola »

Having just read part three of his blog about why he is disrobing I feel it is all for the best, especially because he mentions believing that suffering isn't real.

I am a bit more right-leaning these days politically (though I try not to value my opinions on these matters) so there are some posts of his that I can appreciate on the mundane level. He's not a bad writer at all, he has a very agreeable grammatical and syntactical style.

Part of me does think it's kinda sad, that's a long time to go without success, but if you insist on thinking you have right view before you actually do, then, well, I guess what else is to be expected. I wish him well.
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Re: Ajahn Pannobhasa is disrobing

Post by StrivingforMonkhood »

Oh how politics divides people...

As Buddhists, we must align with a political party that is most in sync with Buddhist teachings. Even if I disagree with the Progressives Liberals in some areas, I have no choice but to support them (liberals believe more in equality; environmental protections; minority rights; higher taxes on the rich, etc.). Right-wing politics refuses to even acknowledge impermanence and all the ugly things that come from denying it (regressive unrealism). We are always evolving as a people. Nothing is stagnant - no time period, no culture, etc. Remember, first and foremost, times change, as it is the nature of existence since beginningless time. I will just mention that as a critique without going into further political ideas, which won't be helpful here.

I don't feel a need to criticize the monk in question, as I know nothing about him. It appears from some reputable folks on here that his beliefs were not in line with pure Buddhist teachings. I suppose there will always be monks who fall out of line in very outrageous ways. It's part of karma, etc. It does nothing to make the Dhamma untrue. People can be totally fake in their lives, putting on a big front for all the world to see. The world is imperfect and always will be. There will always be monastics who fail miserably. That is fine. We need to learn to accept all phenomena. Because a monk who was revered ends up doing something shocking should leave us untouched if we are tightly tethered to the Dhamma.

I have been shocked to find out a few unpleasant things about some Tibetan Buddhist teachers over the years. In Tibetan Buddhism, politics really divides, and that fact breaks my heart. Karma and ignorance are just part of existence - we must accept. The whole scandal with the New Kadampa Tradition (NKT) and the Dalai Lama is just heartbreaking, for one. The political divides are so strong that it's hard to discern who is right and wrong in many areas. Some Tibetan Buddhists are just not able to look past politics, but it doesn't make their teachings untrue; it's just that they are not following them as they should. The nature of existence includes karma and ignorance - there just can't be perfection in the world, even of those searching for enlightenment.

Sometimes talking is just a waste of time, as it does little to change minds, and it has little benefit over all (there are exceptions, of course). It's just to better to go help someone in good faith (with listening, money, actions, etc.), or just go meditate in the forest or some super quiet space.

These thread topics can really get you down. Put your faith in the wisdom from knowing the Dhamma; not in a disrobed monk tied up in scandal.

I think that I've already talked too much. There is very little in life we can control, which includes the behavior of monks. I love monks and nuns with all my heart, and so it bothers me profoundly when some of them go awry. But it's karma and ignorance in this most imperfect world. I cannot cling to my perceptions of how monks should always be.

Peace and enlightenment. :namaste:
May we all fulfill our deepest wish for happiness

We are already Buddha
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