our state just issued a mandate for everyone to wear a mask in public, but i still see people at the grocery store with no mask on. i feel strong dislike, it's surely making me bad kamma, but it's at least revealing the weakness i already had. i feel like most people who don't wear one are either stupid or they are making a political statement. whatever the case, i wish they would cover up their nasty mouth and nose and stop putting others at risk. what can i do to curb my irritation with these people? i don't think anyone can convince me that the pandemic is a complete hoax, but maybe there are some factoids that could help, things to think about that might make me more tolerant again. but this is not so much a topic about coronavirus as a nagging issue i have in daily life, referring to the pandemic but not completely depending on it. so i hope it won't be merged into a huge thread about corona.
i also have an issue at work with others not wearing the mask in a confined space and it's been weird for me to appeal to authority to try to get them to wear the mask. it's been a thing of anxiety -- people don't like me telling on them, don't want control exerted over their bodies. i would care less if i got it but i don't want to spread it to my household.
equanimity for non-mask wearers (personal experience)
- salayatananirodha
- Posts: 1479
- Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:34 am
- Contact:
equanimity for non-mask wearers (personal experience)
I host a sutta discussion via Zoom Sundays at 11AM Chicago time — message me if you are interested
- one_awakening
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:04 am
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Notice the irritation, watch it arise, persist and then subside.
Focus on the irritation, not the person.
_____________________________________________________________________________
Focus on the irritation, not the person.
_____________________________________________________________________________
“You only lose what you cling to”
- retrofuturist
- Posts: 27858
- Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
- Location: Melbourne, Australia
- Contact:
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Greetings,
You don't know if these people have a medical exemption or not, do you?
If they have one, the last thing they need are greasies from a COVID Karen.
Metta,
Paul.
You don't know if these people have a medical exemption or not, do you?
If they have one, the last thing they need are greasies from a COVID Karen.
Metta,
Paul.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
- salayatananirodha
- Posts: 1479
- Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:34 am
- Contact:
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
no, i don't know, but it's also implausible that you can't breathe thru a mask.retrofuturist wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:11 am Greetings,
You don't know if these people have a medical exemption or not, do you?
If they have one, the last thing they need are greasies from a COVID Karen.
Metta,
Paul.
what is greasies?
if they have a respiratory problem that truly prevents them from wearing a mask, what are they doing in a crowded grocery store
six feet is not enough to prevent contraction of an airborne illness
ventilators aren't comfortable either
on a separate note, it's interesting to note people's conceit about their bodies. some guy before the mandate was not wearing a mask and sneezed loudly, and then he said 'dont worry, i'm not sick.' yet people contract the virus without symptoms and may or may not pass on to others.....
i've also been appreciating being outside in general, doesn't matter what i'm doing, it just feels good to be outside. some observations not all directly related to the topic.
Last edited by salayatananirodha on Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
I host a sutta discussion via Zoom Sundays at 11AM Chicago time — message me if you are interested
- salayatananirodha
- Posts: 1479
- Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:34 am
- Contact:
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
i tryone_awakening wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 3:03 am Notice the irritation, watch it arise, persist and then subside.
Focus on the irritation, not the person.
_____________________________________________________________________________
it's hard to maintain that level of contemplation on a day-to-day basis, sometimes i am just trying to live and not be an inward-thinking buddhist ......
I host a sutta discussion via Zoom Sundays at 11AM Chicago time — message me if you are interested
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Not sure where you live, but here in the States, you should be very careful when asking someone to wear their mask, or at least bring a gun with you before you do. Some worker at a store got shot just because they asked the customers to wear it. The US sure is leading the world in everything, including COVID cases!salayatananirodha wrote:i try
it's hard to maintain that level of contemplation on a day-to-day basis, sometimes i am just trying to live and not be an inward-thinking buddhist ......
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Along with those people who wear a mask with a valve, ie. the type of mask that protects the wearer, but not others from the wearer.salayatananirodha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:49 ami feel like most people who don't wear one are either stupid or they are making a political statement.
I think those people are just confident. Confident that nothing bad can ever happen to them; confident that they are healthy and simply cannot infect others; confident that no legal action can successfully be taken against them if they are infected and aren't taking precaution measures to protect others.
If one lacks that confidence, one will feel at a loss when dealing with people who do have such confidence.
Reflect that we are living in a dog-eat-dog world; that kindness and compassion are exceptions to the norm and must usually be earned and payed for.what can i do to curb my irritation with these people?
Be more stingy with your own kindness and compassion, until you can actually practice them without this being some kind of loss for you, however subtle.
And as per the thread title, practice equanimity, ie. reflection on kamma. Beings are the owners and heirs of their actions.
Reflect that others could very well perceive you as dangerous (in the sense that you are a competitor for jobs/promotions; and a health risk).things to think about that might make me more tolerant again.
Thinking of oneself as harmless (or even actually being mostly harmless) can come with a price when living among people who don't think this way.
People in a civilized world are supposed to abide by the social contract. When they don't, this is breach of contract. Hence the feeling of vulnerability and irritation in those who do abide by the social contract while others don't. When one protects others, but others don't protect one, there is a feeling of betrayal, loss.
It has been my impression that most people seem to believe that the laws are for the police to enforce, and nobody else -- regardless of what the laws are about. And they will resist if anyone else, esp. an ordinary citizen, expects them to act in line with the law.i also have an issue at work with others not wearing the mask in a confined space and it's been weird for me to appeal to authority to try to get them to wear the mask. it's been a thing of anxiety -- people don't like me telling on them, don't want control exerted over their bodies.
I think the best thing you can do is to focus on doing your work well, protecting yourself as much as possible with your own actions (wearing a mask, sanitizing your hands etc.).
And as for inspiring others to act in line with sanitary measures: I think the optimal would be to find a few powerful situations, critical moments to bring up the issue. But this can also take up a lot of time and energy to do, so it's not necessarily worth it. And it could be potentially dangerous for you -- like the other person could deliberately cough or spit on you, or even physically assault you.
Hic Rhodus, hic salta!
-
- Posts: 2298
- Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:33 pm
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
I definitely share your experience. I've been trying to reflect that this mask wearing thing is similar to human speech: some speech is pleasant, respectful, some speech is harsh, unpleasant, inconsiderate. All of this is normal and to be expected. All you can really say is that this is the normal constellation of expression of various humans.
Many who do not wear masks do so out of ignorance, too. At a minimum, they should be pitied.
Many who do not wear masks do so out of ignorance, too. At a minimum, they should be pitied.
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
sounds like when the state forced people to believe in god. there is evidence masks can cause the user more harm. i doubt buddhist equanimity was taught to be used in relation to unproven state directivessalayatananirodha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:49 am our state just issued a mandate for everyone to wear a mask in public
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
-
- Posts: 311
- Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:58 pm
- Location: Essex, UK
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
You fear death because you are attached to the body. Because you are attached to the body your neurotic mind needs to control what it perceives as its territory which is located around the vicinity of your body. It is you that is silly for believing that you can somehow hold to the notion that these things can be controlled. These movements of mind are ideas that you have unwittingly inherited from the very society you now fear.salayatananirodha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:49 am our state just issued a mandate for everyone to wear a mask in public, but i still see people at the grocery store with no mask on. i feel strong dislike, it's surely making me bad kamma, but it's at least revealing the weakness i already had. i feel like most people who don't wear one are either stupid or they are making a political statement. whatever the case, i wish they would cover up their nasty mouth and nose and stop putting others at risk. what can i do to curb my irritation with these people? i don't think anyone can convince me that the pandemic is a complete hoax, but maybe there are some factoids that could help, things to think about that might make me more tolerant again. but this is not so much a topic about coronavirus as a nagging issue i have in daily life, referring to the pandemic but not completely depending on it. so i hope it won't be merged into a huge thread about corona.
i also have an issue at work with others not wearing the mask in a confined space and it's been weird for me to appeal to authority to try to get them to wear the mask. it's been a thing of anxiety -- people don't like me telling on them, don't want control exerted over their bodies. i would care less if i got it but i don't want to spread it to my household.
-
- Posts: 1092
- Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 3:21 pm
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
There is no scientific evidence that masks “cause more harm;” there is ample scientific evidence that they help control the spread of specific diseases caused by airborne viruses, like the corona virus. It has always been my understanding that equanimity was taught to be used in nearly all circumstances where anger arises. Pity and compassion for those possessed by ignorance, arrogance, anger, fear, etc. all the harmful emotions) , including ourselves, seems an appropriate response.DooDoot wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:22 pmsounds like when the state forced people to believe in god. there is evidence masks can cause the user more harm. i doubt buddhist equanimity was taught to be used in relation to unproven state directivessalayatananirodha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:49 am our state just issued a mandate for everyone to wear a mask in public
- retrofuturist
- Posts: 27858
- Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
- Location: Melbourne, Australia
- Contact:
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Greetings,
I have also made a "fake" mask, which will do nothing whatsoever to restrict my breathing, based upon its construction materials that I intend to wear when I'm at the shops, so as to avoid triggering COVID Karens and the unpleasantness that comes from that.
Anyway, to the topic, there are valid medical grounds for not wearing a mask, and I'm appreciative that my state recognizes that, at least. Anyone lacking in "equanimity for non-mask wearers" could reflect upon it too.
Metta,
Paul.
I have my written medical exemption from my GP, ready for when my state starts that tonight at midnight.DooDoot wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:22 pmsounds like when the state forced people to believe in god. there is evidence masks can cause the user more harm. i doubt buddhist equanimity was taught to be used in relation to unproven state directivessalayatananirodha wrote: ↑Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:49 am our state just issued a mandate for everyone to wear a mask in public
I have also made a "fake" mask, which will do nothing whatsoever to restrict my breathing, based upon its construction materials that I intend to wear when I'm at the shops, so as to avoid triggering COVID Karens and the unpleasantness that comes from that.
Anyway, to the topic, there are valid medical grounds for not wearing a mask, and I'm appreciative that my state recognizes that, at least. Anyone lacking in "equanimity for non-mask wearers" could reflect upon it too.
Metta,
Paul.
"Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things."
- Nicholas Weeks
- Posts: 4210
- Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:26 pm
- Location: USA West Coast
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Wonder what Maskers think about leaving the nose uncovered? Equally dangerous or not so? I would think the latter.
Good and evil have no fixed form. It's as easy to turn from doing bad to doing good as it is to flip over the hand from the back to the palm. It's simply up to us to do it. Master Hsuan Hua.
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
Appears very sensationalized & dubious but, if so, we must also develop equanimity towards this hysteria. The news says:
Is the Victorian Soviet Govt giving people free face masks? If so, where are they purchased from? I am considering joining Antifa for a free face mask & hoodie:Victoria death toll rises as state rocked by second-worst day of new cases
A woman aged over 100, a woman in her 90s and a woman in her 80s all died, taking the state's death toll to 42 and the national tally to 126.
https://www.9news.com.au/national/coron ... 5fc0df8f09
- Attachments
-
- Antifa.jpg (50.75 KiB) Viewed 15290 times
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
-
- Posts: 1092
- Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 3:21 pm
Re: equanimity for non-mask wearers
The common medical knowledge:
"There are no known medical conditions aside from a severe skin condition [like a very severe burn that needs medical attention] on your face that would prevent a person from wearing this type of mask,” David Kaufman, MD, pulmonologist and director of the medical ICU at Tisch Hospital...
even people with respiratory illnesses—asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), and other lung diseases—can safely wear either surgical or fabric masks in public. "Finding a mask that fits well or a face covering with a fabric that is soft will help you stay comfortable while you help keep your family, friends, neighbors, and community safe from COVID-19 and other contagious diseases," says Dr. Kaufman.
Jim Keany, MD, emergency physician, patient safety physician champion, and former chief of staff at Mission Hospital in Orange County, California agrees that there are no medical conditions that would preclude someone from wearing a simple surgical or cloth face mask, because both masks have "no effect on respiratory mechanics." According to Dr. Keany, however, if you are having trouble breathing while wearing a cloth or surgical mask, you may not be wearing it correctly. "If you feel like you're sucking air through the mask, you are wearing the mask too tight," says Dr. Keany. "Simply look for a mask that has some stiffness to it, so that you don't suck it into your mouth [while breathing].
https://www.health.com/condition/infect ... -face-mask
Please wear masks in public, wash your hands, continue social distancing for the common good and practice equanimity and compassion towards others and yourself. That would seem to be the proper Buddhist response.
"There are no known medical conditions aside from a severe skin condition [like a very severe burn that needs medical attention] on your face that would prevent a person from wearing this type of mask,” David Kaufman, MD, pulmonologist and director of the medical ICU at Tisch Hospital...
even people with respiratory illnesses—asthma, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), and other lung diseases—can safely wear either surgical or fabric masks in public. "Finding a mask that fits well or a face covering with a fabric that is soft will help you stay comfortable while you help keep your family, friends, neighbors, and community safe from COVID-19 and other contagious diseases," says Dr. Kaufman.
Jim Keany, MD, emergency physician, patient safety physician champion, and former chief of staff at Mission Hospital in Orange County, California agrees that there are no medical conditions that would preclude someone from wearing a simple surgical or cloth face mask, because both masks have "no effect on respiratory mechanics." According to Dr. Keany, however, if you are having trouble breathing while wearing a cloth or surgical mask, you may not be wearing it correctly. "If you feel like you're sucking air through the mask, you are wearing the mask too tight," says Dr. Keany. "Simply look for a mask that has some stiffness to it, so that you don't suck it into your mouth [while breathing].
https://www.health.com/condition/infect ... -face-mask
Please wear masks in public, wash your hands, continue social distancing for the common good and practice equanimity and compassion towards others and yourself. That would seem to be the proper Buddhist response.