masturbation what's wrong?

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confusedlayman
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Re: masturbation what's wrong?

Post by confusedlayman »

Ceisiwr wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 2:43 pm
Zom wrote: Mon May 11, 2020 2:02 pm :D
Image
:rofl:
lol. best meme ever.
I may be slow learner but im at least learning...
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mario92
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problem with masturbation

Post by mario92 »

Namaste since i ended school in december 2017 i had tried to be celibate, but never succeed for a long time, at this time i think it is not wise to keep following that path. Problems with acne had arisen and also digestive problems, sleep problems and fatigue. I had tried asubha and meditation but i am still subject to desire as still watch facebook (and youtube and also have instagram due to bussiness issue) to counter atack disatisfaction and discontent, also everyday beautiful ladies enter my store, so im bombarded everyday. I also have problems with pornography, but i do my best to avoid using the phone. I want to ask some questions how do 5 precept practitioner deal with desire? Is taoist sex the only way to suceed as layman(like retaining seminal luquid and thus having good health)? My father tells me that i should look for a girlfriend, but social and economic conditions along the fear of getting sexual disease, having an unwanted pregnancy also arise in my mind, and also that woman can be very evil (from experience), or that you dont know if the other person is married (some can lie). Also, do desire diminish if i have girlfriend? Thanks I think one of the main problems is bad health.
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mario92
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by mario92 »

i also think that every time i tried to remain celibate something Mara or i dont know, the temptations are more.
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Pondera
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Pondera »

Use a condom. Get laid. Stop masturbating. Don’t get into a relationship. Just “play the field”. Start living so that you can see how fruitless sex and women are.

Stop looking at porn. Start talking to woman. Ask one on a date. Have fun. You only live once in a lifetime.
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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JamesTheGiant
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by JamesTheGiant »

mario92 wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 1:45 am i had tried to be celibate,
What is your motivation for being celibate?

You know for 5-precept layperson, total celibacy is not necessary. That's for 8-precept laypeople.
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mario92
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by mario92 »

JamesTheGiant wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 2:45 am
mario92 wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 1:45 am i had tried to be celibate,
What is your motivation for being celibate?

You know for 5-precept layperson, total celibacy is not necessary. That's for 8-precept laypeople.
Namaste James, My main reason in being celibate was having good health and vigour (extra energy), also when i am not celibate i have to restart again and think about the whole thing, i cant concentrate easily in my shores. Also the health issues i mentioned in first post. But i had failed many times i see is not for me at this point.
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salayatananirodha
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by salayatananirodha »

think you have to develop yourself as a meditator to have the desire to remain celibate. seeing drawbacks will begin a process for you of withdrawing from the activity. for me its been wavering between extremes. if you want to be celibate, then do so. if you dont want to, then dont commit sexual misconduct. dont go with girls under the protection of another, their parents, a husband, a fiancé, the law, etc.
if you arent replacing worldly bliss with unworldly bliss you'll just keep coming back. in which case you still have to find a meaningful way to practice
however, there is nothing wrong healthwise with abstaining from sex or masturbation. and if you are someone with an earnest desire then there is nothing wrong with making efforts to stop engagements.
I host a sutta discussion via Zoom Sundays at 11AM Chicago time — message me if you are interested
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mario92
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by mario92 »

Thanks salayatananirodha
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dicsoncandra
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by dicsoncandra »

Hi mario92,

As I have repeated in another post, please see below :anjali:

By contemplating on dukkha in craving and practicing sense restraint. When we experience craving of any sort, take a second to let it endure and note the unpleasantness of it in the form of restlessness, anxiety and 'heat' for not having what we deem pleasurable. This is based on the wrong assumption (upādāna) that happiness is found in the external while craving manifests, ceases and endures (with varying intensity) within the mind. When we indulge in sense pleasure, the underlying pain from having the 'craving' in the first place is not removed but rather temporarily masked by the senses as a distraction. Worse, giving in to sense pleasure perpetuates the cycle of craving that will seek out for more with greater intensity to mask that insatiable thirst.

Furthermore, it helps to contemplate on anicca with regard to the five aggregates and hence anatta. To contemplate on how moods and emotions change so rapidly to be unpleasant and endures when we find ourselves immersed in this wrong assumption, and that instead of them being owned by us, we are always subjected to them involuntarily, which turns into dukkha when we cling to them (running to the pleasurable/away from the displeasurable). Thus, we shall diligently practice sense restraint, contemplate and learn that whatever manifests as dukkha (with symptoms of restlessness, etc.) cannot be 'I', 'mine' or 'myself'.

For further information on self restraint practices and the logic behind them, I highly recommend checking out Hillside Hermitage youtube channel as I have personally benefited from listening to their talks

:anjali:
Best Wishes
arising is manifest;
ceasing is manifest;
change-while-standing is manifest.

Link to website: http://dicsonstable.blog/
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StrivingforMonkhood
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by StrivingforMonkhood »

@ OP

Everything is really okay somehow - it really is.

I deal with the same sort of issue as you. You're not alone. :thinking:

Ground yourself as much as you can in the Holy Dhamma. Surround yourself in Buddhist communities who can give you sound advice.

Don't feel guilty about masturbation, or whatever. The only way you can stop doing unwholesome activities is by "seeing more clearly". Repression doesn't work here - it just builds up anger and frustration.

I wish that you become a very happy person.

Peace and enlightenment. :anjali:
May we all fulfill our deepest wish for happiness

We are already Buddha
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Ceisiwr
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Ceisiwr »

Pondera wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 2:31 am Use a condom. Get laid. Stop masturbating. Don’t get into a relationship. Just “play the field”. Start living so that you can see how fruitless sex and women are.

Stop looking at porn. Start talking to woman. Ask one on a date. Have fun. You only live once in a lifetime.
That is appalling advise.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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Ceisiwr
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Ceisiwr »

mario92 wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 1:45 am Namaste since i ended school in december 2017 i had tried to be celibate, but never succeed for a long time, at this time i think it is not wise to keep following that path. Problems with acne had arisen and also digestive problems, sleep problems and fatigue. I had tried asubha and meditation but i am still subject to desire as still watch facebook (and youtube and also have instagram due to bussiness issue) to counter atack disatisfaction and discontent, also everyday beautiful ladies enter my store, so im bombarded everyday. I also have problems with pornography, but i do my best to avoid using the phone. I want to ask some questions how do 5 precept practitioner deal with desire? Is taoist sex the only way to suceed as layman(like retaining seminal luquid and thus having good health)? My father tells me that i should look for a girlfriend, but social and economic conditions along the fear of getting sexual disease, having an unwanted pregnancy also arise in my mind, and also that woman can be very evil (from experience), or that you dont know if the other person is married (some can lie). Also, do desire diminish if i have girlfriend? Thanks I think one of the main problems is bad health.
Celibacy can come easier to some, but for most it takes time. It might help to think of it in terms of abandoning one pleasure for a higher one, namely the pleasure of jhāna. The more you refrain from sex or giving into sexual urges, like masturbation, the more you guard the sense doors. In turn this starves the hindrances and nourishes the awakening factors, which means meditation becomes easier and much more pleasant with jhāna being ever more closer. If you do, however, slip then don't beat yourself up about it. Just review what went wrong and try harder again. You are also young, so you have a lot of hormones driving you to do it to contend with. All this takes a lot of effort, but it is achievable. But, patience is the key as is not getting too down on yourself when slipups happen. That being said, if you really can't do it then there is nothing wrong in finding a partner and having sex. Just look for real commitment though rather than just sleeping around, make sure she is of good character and of course avoid pornography. Apart from anything it gives men and women unrealistic expectations of sex. It's all acting. Finally if you are worried about sexual diseases or unwanted pregnancies, then using a condom is a good idea.
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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Pondera
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Pondera »

Ceisiwr wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 8:23 pm
Pondera wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 2:31 am Use a condom. Get laid. Stop masturbating. Don’t get into a relationship. Just “play the field”. Start living so that you can see how fruitless sex and women are.

Stop looking at porn. Start talking to woman. Ask one on a date. Have fun. You only live once in a lifetime.
That is appalling advise.
Yeah. You’re right. He should pursue a deep relationship between his right hand and his iPhone.

That’s the best use of time.

Let me guess? You’re a virgin too? :rofl:
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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Pondera
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Pondera »

Ceisiwr wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 8:28 pm
mario92 wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 1:45 am Namaste since i ended school in december 2017 i had tried to be celibate, but never succeed for a long time, at this time i think it is not wise to keep following that path. Problems with acne had arisen and also digestive problems, sleep problems and fatigue. I had tried asubha and meditation but i am still subject to desire as still watch facebook (and youtube and also have instagram due to bussiness issue) to counter atack disatisfaction and discontent, also everyday beautiful ladies enter my store, so im bombarded everyday. I also have problems with pornography, but i do my best to avoid using the phone. I want to ask some questions how do 5 precept practitioner deal with desire? Is taoist sex the only way to suceed as layman(like retaining seminal luquid and thus having good health)? My father tells me that i should look for a girlfriend, but social and economic conditions along the fear of getting sexual disease, having an unwanted pregnancy also arise in my mind, and also that woman can be very evil (from experience), or that you dont know if the other person is married (some can lie). Also, do desire diminish if i have girlfriend? Thanks I think one of the main problems is bad health.
Celibacy can come easier to some, but for most it takes time. It might help to think of it in terms of abandoning one pleasure for a higher one, namely the pleasure of jhāna. The more you refrain from sex or giving into sexual urges, like masturbation, the more you guard the sense doors. In turn this starves the hindrances and nourishes the awakening factors, which means meditation becomes easier and much more pleasant with jhāna being ever more closer. If you do, however, slip then don't beat yourself up about it. Just review what went wrong and try harder again. You are also young, so you have a lot of hormones driving you to do it to contend with. All this takes a lot of effort, but it is achievable. But, patience is the key as is not getting too down on yourself when slipups happen. That being said, if you really can't do it then there is nothing wrong in finding a partner and having sex. Just look for real commitment though rather than just sleeping around, make sure she is of good character and of course avoid pornography. Apart from anything it gives men and women unrealistic expectations of sex. It's all acting. Finally if you are worried about sexual diseases or unwanted pregnancies, then using a condom is a good idea.
Nope. Don’t get into a committed relationship.

The Buddha defined sexual misconduct as sleeping with a woman who was under the protection and guardianship of her parents or a husband.

There is nothing wrong with having sex with a single woman who is also an independent woman.

Getting into a committed relationship for the sake of sexual urges is a recipe for disaster.

You should “play the field”. Get an idea of what’s good and bad about sex. Don’t (as the above person advises) commit your heart and soul emotionally just so that you can be hurt by that person later.

The underlying motivation for these relationships is sex. Cut out the middle man. Don’t fall into the trap. And don’t waste your testosterone building memories of naked woman flaunting and parading their selves on a small, hand held screen.
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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Pondera
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Re: problem with masturbation

Post by Pondera »

Ceisiwr wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 8:23 pm
Pondera wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 2:31 am Use a condom. Get laid. Stop masturbating. Don’t get into a relationship. Just “play the field”. Start living so that you can see how fruitless sex and women are.

Stop looking at porn. Start talking to woman. Ask one on a date. Have fun. You only live once in a lifetime.
That is appalling advise.

Men were real in the Buddha’s time. Look:
As I was leaving from home, reverend Sir, a Sakyan girl, the most beautiful woman in the country, with her hair half-combed, having looked round, said this to me: ‘Master, may you quickly return.’ Remembering that, reverend Sir, I have no great delight living the spiritual life, I am not able to endure the spiritual life, and having disavowed the training, I will return to what is inferior.”

Then the Gracious One, having taken venerable Nanda by the arm, just as a strong man might stretch out a bent arm, or bend in an outstretched arm, in the same way did he disappear from Jeta’s Wood, and reappear amongst the Tāvatiṁsa devas. Then at that time five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs had come to attend to Sakka, the lord of the devas.

Then the Gracious One addressed venerable Nanda, saying:

“Do you see, Nanda, these five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs?”

“Yes, reverend Sir.”

“What do you think about this, Nanda, who has the most perfect form, is the most fair to behold, is the most pleasing, the Sakyan girl, the most beautiful woman in the country, or these five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs?”

“Like a disfigured monkey, reverend Sir, with its ears and nose cut off, so is the Sakyan girl, reverend Sir, the most beautiful woman in the country, compared with these five hundred celestial nymphs she does not count, she is not even a fraction, she is not even half a fraction, she is not even to be compared! These five hundred celestial nymphs certainly have the most perfect form, are the most fair to behold, are the more pleasing.”

“Take delight, Nanda! Take delight, Nanda! I am your surety for gaining five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs!”
“If, reverend Sir, the Gracious One is my surety for gaining five hundred celestial dove-footed nymphs, I will take great delight, reverend Sir, in living the spiritual life under the Gracious One.”
Now Nanda eventually comes to his senses, but what do we see here? What compels Nanda above all? Just pure carnal lust - based on physical attraction.

Nanda doesn’t want a hooty tooty relationship. He wants beautiful nymphs. 500 of them. For sex, probably. :rofl:
Like the three marks of conditioned existence, this world in itself is filthy, hostile, and crowded
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